Marketing Madness: How to Successfully Build Your Master Class Online (Learn it All from Cat Howell)

Welcome to the podcast. I’m Shane Barker, your host of Shane Barker’s Marketing Madness podcast. Today, we have with us Cat Howell, founder and CEO of Eight Loop Social and the Facebook Ad Academy. In today’s episode, she’s going to let us in on some really big secrets. We’re going to talk about how to take clients from zero to six-figure revenue.
In the past, she’s worked with big names like Coca-Cola, Teal, and Contiki to help them grow their businesses. I’m excited to learn from her and get to know more about her entrepreneurial journey.

So did you actually grow up in New Zealand?

You’re Canadian?

He imported you? Was that Willy Lee, or was that kind of like your…

Well, okay, that’s good to know. And what was he doing? Why did you guys move out? Was there a business or something?

I know, I know. I’m not—probably. I know I made it seem like I was, like, part of that group or something. You’re like, “No, it’s…” But I’ll tell you right now, in California, it’s like—this morning when I went on my walk, it was 46 degrees. That’s cold for California. And I wore flip flops. People probably thought I should’ve been on my medication.

Okay, I’m gonna have to move to New Zealand. I think you guys are, like, number nine on my list. You’re number two, actually—if I win the lottery, I’m literally just going to become a Kiwi. That’s the plan.
Yeah, yeah—we’re number one. Like, why wouldn’t I? Right? I mean, I’ll just come out there and bring you your money, like some unmarked bills or something in a briefcase, and you’re like, “Look what I have for Cat.” You win again. Or we win again.

Really? So you’ve been able to sneak cocaine through just fine, but you got caught with fruit. Is that what you’re saying? I mean, I’m just… you don’t have to tell me, because it’s not like this is being recorded or anything. The whole world’s gonna hear this.
So there are certain things you were able to get through, and certain things where you got busted. So that’s cool. That was gonna be my next question: what can I sneak into the country?

Yeah, my brother—and this is a true story—my brother actually, God, I don’t know what country he was coming from, but he actually got busted bringing a mango into the US. It was kind of an accidental thing. I’m not kidding—he’s not on a “do not fly” list or anything, but they give him a little extra… I don’t know if he gets the glove test, but they definitely give him the “Oh, Mango boy” treatment.
Like, “Sir, let’s go ahead and see with a strip down over here. We’re gonna play a little game called ‘Where’s the mango?’” And it’s… I don’t know, man.
And once again, I don’t know if he travels because he likes that game or what, but yeah, he’s definitely on some kind of list.
And actually—this is choking aside—I ended up on a list recently too. I didn’t get, like, the “crazy test” in India, but they definitely flagged me. I don’t think I look like the traveling type, maybe that’s why?
I mean, maybe it’s the mango connection. Like, yeah, we’ve all smuggled a few mangoes through private places and airports. You know how it goes. You buy it for your family. But anyway—fruit flies. Got it. I’m adding that to the “Do Not Pack” list when I come visit you.

It’s the beer. It’s either beer or mangoes. That’s their thing. I don’t know if he’s got an ounce of coke—or an ounce of mango, to be honest.
So, yeah, we all have our vices, I guess. So, you grew up in Canada. Is your whole family there too? How big of a family do you have in Canada?

Gotcha. So not that big of a family.

Where does your sister live?

Oh, she is? Yeah, I was just in Vancouver. They were hosting—what was the name of the conference? Anyway, it was a conference they had out there about three weeks ago. I went out and had some fun with the Uber team—Uber flips, I think that’s what they called it.
It was right there, super convenient. And man, it was awesome. The conference was right across the street from my hotel, and the food around there? Just phenomenal. So yeah, I’m a big fan.
Oh right—you said Vancouver, not Toronto. Yeah, Vancouver. I’ve only been to Vancouver once. Never been to Toronto.

Yeah, no, it definitely does. And that’s—I’m in Sacramento. So like, the hub of where I live is, like, San Francisco is an hour and a half away, and the beach is an hour and a half away. And it’s not like this—I mean, it’s still California prices, but it’s not like San Francisco where you’re, like, you know, you have 1,000 square feet and it’s, you know, like $5,000 a month or something crazy. So it’s still economical.
In fact—long story short—I flip properties here too. That’s why we do this in this area, because everybody on the outskirts has all kinds of money, and they come to Sacramento and buy something that’s like a mansion compared to what they live in in the city.
So yeah, so give us some—I mean, other than the fact that your ex-husband kidnapped you and brought you to New Zealand—what other fun facts do you have? Anything else like growing up, or anything else that was interesting in terms of how you were raised—anything that nobody would know about?

You’re like, “I used to be a stripper,” but other than that, I’m just kind of a regular girl. I’m boring.
You’re like, “I don’t know if that’s really what we think here.” I don’t think we’re interviewing you today because you’re like, “I just don’t have much to say, and I’m kind of boring.” I think it’s maybe potentially the opposite of that interesting.
So you stripped—so not that we need to go into stripping in Canada and rights and laws and stuff—but what? So you have to be, obviously, 18 in Canada, snuck in with a little fake ID and said, “Listen, nobody’s gonna, right?”
Nobody’s gonna not—if I want to dance, if the cat wants to dance, the cat gets to dance, right? Like, I’ll ask you my next question then.
Is Cat your real name? Is that your stage name? Have you—I mean, is this your real… I just want to make sure it’s your real name, now that we’ve jumped on those.

Jazz. Man, I could have jazz. Interesting. Okay, these are all fun facts.
Yeah, and everybody has a different thing. So I love it because, you know, some people—when you interview one podcast, very conservative, so they’re like, “Well, this one time I, you know, stole the banana from my neighbor’s yard.” You’re like, “Oh my God, it’s crazy.”
And you’re like, so here’s—
Yeah, exactly, yeah. It’s like, but you’re just like, well, for a little bit. Kind of did my thing, not a big deal.
And then so obviously, so you’re New Zealand, and did you go to college in Canada as well?
No, in New Zealand.
Ah, so in New Zealand. So when did you—so you guys moved to New Zealand, pretty, like you were in your college days?

There we go. I like that. He just rescued you. I like that—well, like, kind of like Batman, a little different.

Yeah, hello. It’s all making sense. This is all coming together very nicely. I was a little wondering how this was going to come together, but it’s, it is. It is.
So then you, you actually—and so then you graduated from, where, New Zealand—what college?

Yeah, isn’t that crazy? Like, I have—and I’m not going to go into heavy detail, but not that I was a stripper by any means, because they probably wouldn’t let me—
but there were certain things that I’ve seen, people that I know, that have sales or have done stuff that was like the psychology of working with people. And whether that be you’re knocking on doors, selling something, or whether it’s, you know, whatever that is, but the psychology of that and how understanding how people work, and how people, you know, get somebody to say yes—
those certain things, I think, are really interesting.

Because you really can’t—
I can give you an example I’ve talked about in the past. It’s like Mormons, right? So the religion of being Mormon.
You go in, in a two-year thing of selling a religion. Like, can you imagine? Like, you knock on doors and people are like,
“Screw you,” and you’re like, “Cool, thank you so much. God bless you,” you know? Then you go to the next one.
Like, how many no’s can you take?

But those—
a lot of those guys and girls, when it comes to that religion, it’s because they’re like great salespeople, because they’re used to—like, they have their son, the hardest thing in the world—like, religion, right?
To people that probably don’t want anything to do with it, for the most part, yeah.
And then if you’re able to really sell that—I mean, that’s like, you know?

So they come out of there, they’re like, “I can tell me no a thousand times. I’m just looking for the one yes.”
And so they’re, like, they grind it out, you know. It’s kind of a different deal.

Alarm companies here in the US—alarm companies.
And there’s a lot of, what else—there’s a few other ones that I have friends of friends that, you know, once again, they’re really good at those type of door-to-door sales because of their background and, you know, selling religion.

Yeah, so $2,000—I mean, that’s obviously a huge variance.
Do you think it was the power of the motorboat?
Do you think that maybe it was, like, sometimes you were like, “I’m kind of into it. It’s a Tuesday.”
And then other times you’re like, “It’s a Saturday, like, the motorboat was over the top.”

Because people feel the vibe, right?
Because it’s like, you’re kind of—if you’re into it and having fun, then people are like, “Oh, okay.”
Then it’s like, naturally, you’re kind of getting into it.
That makes total sense.

I like the motorboating too, because that kind of, once again, brings it all back to where we need to be in regards to things we’ve done in our past.

Why wouldn’t you create a course on motor boating? I mean, it feels like there’s a niche there. Some people are out there thinking, ‘I’ve got one part down, but I’m not really sure how to do both.’ So you offer the course—make it simple. Like, ‘Here, take the course. It’s no big deal.’ Then you’ve got something people can run with and even make more money from down the line. Not a bad thing at all.

That’s all that positioning, for sure. So there’s a great segue. So tell us a little bit about Eight Loop Social. So how did you start that? You already have an interesting story, obviously, with your background and everything. Like, how did you jump into that, in regards to the agency side of thing? Give us a little background.

Cool. So is it true that you let your ex-husband keep that license plate on his car because the company bombed, and it kind of felt like the relationship did too? Like, “Hey, why don’t you go ahead and take the plate from the company that tanked and drive around with it—you’re a loser in both the vehicle and the business.” Meanwhile, I’ll take the satisfaction of knowing I didn’t start another company with him. Is that what happened, or did it just kind of unfold that way?

You hold on to that thing. It’s going to age like fine wine. Just let it be. Let it mature. I’m probably going to get threatened if your ex listens to this. He’ll be like, “Oh, you think you’re funny, Redbeard? You’re a loser too, driving around in that old car!” Yeah, exactly—for this moment, you’ve got some mangoes in your bag.

Next time you’re in New Zealand and get busted, better get those bags wrapped tight.

I definitely will. I’ll stash the fruit flies somewhere. So back to your agency—you run your own shop, right? And your goal is to work with other agencies? That’s your brand, correct? Working through Facebook, with ads being a big part of how you drive revenue?

Yeah, I don’t know what porn is. I’m gonna look that up when we’re done with this podcast. It sounds familiar, but I’m like, I don’t know why. It’s so weird. I’ll do a little research. But for the podcast—of course—yeah, so that’s interesting. They say it’s like, actually, huh? In courses? That’s so funny.

So I’m actually working on a course right now. We’re going live probably in about a month. It’s on howtobeaninfluencer.com—it’s the course I love. And the premise, the whole idea, is based on that. I taught a personal branding course at UCLA, right? So, like five years ago, I bought that domain thinking, “This is going to be big.” I was just jumping into the influencer space and bought a bunch of influencer domains.

And I thought, “Oh, this is going to be something.” Especially because I already teach a class at UCLA on personal branding and having an influencer identity. That’s where all of this kind of came from.

But what really blew me away was what my brother said—he works at Creative Live, in San Francisco. He was like, “The course thing is blowing up.” So many people are doing these courses, and people are actually buying them. And I’m just sitting there going, “Why would someone pay $100 for a course?” Like, I could just Google that. But then I realized—if you get 5,000 people to buy a $100 course, that’s $500,000. I mean, the numbers are wild.

And what’s even crazier is you don’t need a niche the whole world knows about. It’s almost better to be hyper-specific—like “how to find trolls in New Zealand.” And, of course, how to collect them. There’s plenty of trolls out there, so find your own.

Anyway, that’s probably Course Two or Three down the line.

So yeah, I can totally see this space growing, but I’m curious: what are some of the things you teach in your courses? And how long have you been doing them?

Awesome. And obviously, you’ve helped a number of your clients get to, like, six-figure revenues. What are some of the pillars or tactics you focus on? I know it’s not like a magic formula, but when people ask you, “What do I focus on to build a course or scale something?”—what are your big five?

Yeah, that always seems to be the big thing for most people—it’s just, like, not launching, right? They’re scared to death of this or that. I talk about it with my UCLA students. The biggest thing is just doing it. Just start writing, start doing something. It might—it’s probably going to be terrible. Every first article I ever wrote was terrible. The first video anyone does on YouTube is terrible. It’s always like that, right? It just is what it is. You have to get over it.

And the thing is—and I’ve talked about this before—but the way I got my job, or my career, the whole thing going at UCLA, being an instructor, was because of my content. Like, literally, if I hadn’t put my content out there, they wouldn’t have known who I was. I didn’t apply for a job in personal branding or the influencer space—they reached out to me because I was a practitioner and they had read one of my articles. So, you know, it’s like—if I hadn’t done that… You have to put it out there. And of course, it’s scary and all that other stuff.

I have a friend—might say his name, he probably listens to the podcast—but his girlfriend has been working on this Facebook thing for probably two years now. And I’m like, you guys, by the time you launch, all the stuff you put out is old. You know? So it’s like, you gotta just go. Just put some stuff out.

And with my course, we’re kind of doing what you talked about. We’re gonna launch it with, like, eight or ten videos—whatever that foundation is—and then we’ll build on it as people start asking questions. Like, “Hey, we had a question about this,” and I’ll say, great, now I can build something around that.

And really, the foundation of what I’m doing—it’s a course on how to be an influencer—but it’s not necessarily like, “here’s how to get a pink poodle, hop on a private jet, and eat caviar,” right? I mean, maybe. But the idea is really about building a personal brand and a foundation—how to pitch brands, how to get a free hotel stay, get your car payment covered, whatever it is.

It’s about understanding the psychology of how to do that, and explaining to influencers why they need to show their value to brands—because most brands don’t know how to work with influencers. They don’t know what to ask. They don’t know how to negotiate. They don’t understand the process. So we want to help influencers be able to create that structure and actually communicate the value they provide.

Yeah, it’ll be interesting. I’m really looking forward to it. I’ll probably pick your brain. We’ll probably keep in touch. That’s probably when I’ll show up with that briefcase full of lottery money, and you’ll be like, “Hey, looks like you owe me a free hour or something,” or whatever the deal is. Yeah, cool.

So, when it comes to developing courses—I mean, I know we kind of talked about strategies and things that help increase conversions—but can you tell us maybe an example of a client you’ve worked with? I’m just trying to think about what everyone wants, which is a course that makes money.

But I think you kind of touched on it already—it’s the same thing with influencer marketing. People reach out to me like, “Hey, I read your article that says for every $1, you can make $8 with influencer marketing. I want that program.” And I’m like—yeah, everyone does. Of course. But that doesn’t happen for everybody, right? We have to set the right expectations.

So can you tell us a story, maybe about a client you’ve worked with where you guys absolutely crushed it? A really great course, strong results—give me a good case study where Cat went out and just crushed it.

Yeah. And we are gonna—we’re gonna be doing something. I mean, the thing is, we’ve worked this thing kind of backwards because we’ve done a lot, and I’ve done a lot in the influencer space, and I’ve been writing about it for seven or eight years. I do a lot of keynote speeches related to it, but I don’t do tons of managed services anymore. It’s like, because we used to do tons of managed services, and then we’re kind of pulling back now and just doing the education side of things.

I mean, they’re still continuously learning, and obviously, we have influencers on the podcast, and so there’ll be, you know, tie-ins there, but I might talk to you about the messaging side of things. Because there is—once again—there’s a thing I’ve always fought with, like, do I go real general? Like, hey, all influencers—like, “Hey, we’re just here to help you make a foundation,” whether you’re doing makeup or whether you’re, you know, whatever you’re doing, right?

Or is it your—if you’re just looking for free hotel stays, it’s still like you have to have this base of, like, “Hey, your website and custom email address,” and like, just stuff. You’re not gonna be superhotgirl29@gmail.com. Like, you know, you’re gonna get all the Nike, and I’m like, “Okay, you gotta kind of pull your stuff together a little better,” right? So that’d be interesting.

Well, I’ll talk to you about the messaging. Do you guys obviously help with messaging when it comes to courses? Is that something more? Do you guys have a course on messaging?

And we have done that with clients in the past where it’s like, you really just see where the funnels are at the right scene and see if people are going to bite on it. That’s kind of the big thing is, because people create something and they throw it out there, like, nobody bites, like, “Well, that sucks.” I’m like, yeah, because you spend six months on it and nobody likes it, right?

It’s like you really want to, kind of, and you talk about agile, right? Talk about, like, being able to, like, move on or change or go in a different direction, or whatever you need to do. And I think some people don’t understand the value in that. I mean, I think they will, after they do a course and spend all the money, and then don’t sell anything, they’re like, “Okay, maybe I should have put a little more time into, like, researching and take a look at this as little, not think tanks, but, you know, these funnels to see if they’re working,” because you’re going to put it out there, and somebody goes, “Now you’re every dollar, you’re making $2.” Well, that’s—that’s a good little deal going right now. You can, you know, build that course around that, because, you know, there’s some interest there.

No, and I love that, because I think that is a big thing. I think everybody just looks at failure. That’s what I look at when I talk to people. They’re like, “Well, how can I be successful?” and I’m like, “Well, you’ve got to fail.” Ten thousand times. People are like, “What do you mean? You want me to go fail?” and I’m like, literally, everybody who’s where they’re at today is there because they failed, right?

The people who haven’t failed are the ones who didn’t try. Because 99% of people aren’t going to make it on their first try. And then your second business is probably going to fail. You just have to go through that process. I mean, that’s a healthy process, right? We’re all where we’re at today because we face-planted 100 times, 1,000 times—whatever that number is. But you use that. And if you don’t understand, if you don’t learn from that, then that is a failure. Because if you’re not taking that and going, “Ooh, I did this wrong. Oh, I kind of got some investment money early. Oh, I probably shouldn’t have gone to that club and motorboated too many times,” or whatever it is, right? You’ve got to look at those numbers—obviously on the P&Ls.

But I think it’s important that people realize, like, hey, I wouldn’t be where I’m at today if I hadn’t had that. I talked about this in one of my last podcasts, and I’m not gonna go into heavy detail, but I got sued by the Attorney General of California for $65 million.

And I know that was kind of like your thing—you were like, “I was 16 and I was a stripper.” Well, I got sued for 65 million. So there we go. Now that we’re all just counting secrets.

For me, it was one of these things where I was like, “Oh my God, what just happened?” I won’t go into heavy detail because I’ve talked about it a little bit on the podcast, but what happened was, what I learned through that whole process—the good, the bad, the ugly—was something you couldn’t have taught me at Harvard. There’s no business school that could’ve said, “Hey, Shane, let’s put you through a fake situation where you get sued by the Attorney General and spend the next two years and $2 million fighting them.” I would’ve been like, “That sounds like real life. I don’t think I want to do that.”

But I didn’t ask for that, right? And sometimes things just happen in your life. It is what it is. And so I look at things like you do. People are like, “Oh, but you failed at that?” and I’m like, “No, not at all, man. Not at all.” That just means I found one more thing I shouldn’t do. Or I learned something. Or I figured out how to do it differently. Those are all wins. It’s all perception—how you look at things. And I think a lot of people miss out on that.

I actually have a buddy of mine, Chris Rudin, and we’re doing a company called Fail Forward. And the idea is that you fail, and then you go forward. If you don’t, then there you go—you failed. And yeah, you can cry, you can do whatever. I’m not saying don’t be emotional, or don’t say, “God, that sucks,” or don’t spend a week by yourself—whatever you need to do. But you’ve got to move forward. That’s the thing. You’ve got to get back up. And it’s how quickly you do that, and how quickly you learn to say, “You know what? I’m going to be smarter with the way I do things.”

Because the way I start a business today is 1,000 times different from how I did 20 years ago. Back then, I had investment money and thought, “I’m going to go buy a press release.” I think I paid like $500 for it. And this lady hands it to me, and I go, “Hey, what do I do with this?” and she goes, “I don’t know. I mean, I just write press releases.” I was like, “I guess I go give it to my mom or something. I got a press release.” And she’s like, “That’s really good, Shane.” I’m like, “Thank you. We’ll put it on the fridge.”

I didn’t know what to do, right? Like, how do I use this stuff? And back then there wasn’t this huge internet we have now where you can do distribution. But you just learn. Now, I can get a beautiful press release written for ten dollars.

So it’s just, there are things you learn. And once again, now you have these things that you’re like, “Oh, okay.” And that’s where courses come in. I think that’s what people don’t realize with courses. I truly think anybody could do a course, because you have knowledge. You have things you’ve learned in your life that are unique to you. And if you can put that into something and find somebody who wants to learn what you know—no matter what it is—there’s your course.

People don’t really understand that. Like, literally anything you’ve done in the past 10–15 years, you’ve learned something from it. Whether it’s how to backpack, how to save money on car insurance, how to use credit cards, how to open your own business—whatever it is—there’s someone out there who wants to know.

And obviously, you can do keyword research and find out what people are already looking for. That’s when it starts to get interesting.

So I’ve been working on another thing—a website. I probably shouldn’t say this, because my team told me not to tell anyone. But it’s called something like HowToGetMyExBack.com. We’ve been working on it, because I didn’t realize there were hundreds of thousands of people a month looking up the same searches: how do I get my ex back, how do I get my girlfriend back, how do I get my boyfriend back, how do I fix this, how do I answer their texts?

And a lot of it is basic stuff. Like, don’t drink and text them. Don’t drive by their house. Don’t go buy a gun. Try not to be too crazy, right? Don’t do anything outlandish. But it’s an interesting space. So it’s something I’m working on now, and yeah, I probably shouldn’t have told anybody, because it was kind of a secret project. My team was like, “Don’t tell anyone,” and I’m like, “I won’t—until tomorrow.” But up until that point, nobody will know. We’ll just release this podcast in 2028 or something. We won’t even be around, but that’s okay. At least we had fun while we were here on this earth.

So yeah, that’s interesting. I’ll have to talk to you a little more about it. That came about because I was doing some keyword research and just randomly saw the numbers, and I thought, “Oh my God, look at all these people.” And once again, it happens over and over—people breaking up and getting back together and all the fun stuff. And people want to figure it out. Usually, when you’ve just gone through a breakup, you’re in a different state of mind, and you end up doing absolutely all the wrong things.

Yeah—from what I’ve heard. I’ve never done that before.

Okay, so tell me a little bit about Pay the Invoice. Because obviously I’ve heard a lot of good things about it, and I’ve been following you online, on Instagram and other stuff. What was the premise behind Pay the Invoice, and what is it? I mean, obviously I have an idea, but I want you to tell the audience—what’s the premise behind it? Why did you create it?

Just your candor. Like, just your—it’s just very refreshing. Like, “I smoked a joint, and then we decided to do a web series,” like our doc series. Like, there we go. I mean, most people would leave out a few parts there, but I love it back. You’re like, so we started off, I was just gonna eat some ice cream, and I was like, why don’t we bring on the whole production team and do a production with no scripts? And that sounds like a great idea, but it’s awesome.

Once again, I think it’s interesting. This is how you do that, because once again, you talk about, you know, there’s people that over-prepare. Like, in the beginning, you were like, over-preparing for everything, right? You got to do this, captions, your voice and this, and now you’re just smoking joints. And you’re like, “Hey, I’m gonna go ahead and do this.” And then people are like, this is kind of low, crazy. I mean, do you get that a lot? Like, people were like, I think you’re crazy. And then you’re like, “Yeah, kind of like, whatever. I pass the ice cream and we’re gonna do this on Tuesday.”

Yeah, I’ll tell you what it was. It was a joint. I mean, yeah, that joint was like, “You know what? I know—I don’t know. We need to plan this out. Hold on real quick… All right, let’s just do this. Do this. Who’s down?” And everybody’s like, “Whoa, I guess… I think we’re down. Let me hit that, and then we’ll see if we’re just as down as you are.”

No, I think that’s awesome. I think that’s really awesome that you kind of— I mean, once again, I know that it takes resources, and my team hasn’t put me on restriction like your team has yet, but I am very close. Because I am a little bit—and if my team is on the line right now, they’re probably cussing me out—but I am the “Hey, I’ve got an idea” guy.

And if my partner… every time—I mean, he would actually be a millionaire forever if I gave him a dollar for every time I said, “Hey dude, I got an idea.” He’d be like, “Jesus. Here we go. Shane’s idea. What did you do over the weekend, Shane?”

I’m like, “No, I just—I saw this one thing, and I was kind of thinking…”

Let me ask you this—how big of a team do you have?

So now, this is going to be funny. So it used to be—like, I literally had to go to a domain therapist. Not really, but I mean, there was a certain point where I had, I think, over five or six hundred domains. This was probably about seven or eight years ago. Oh, you’re like, “Crazy,” but I had some really… I can’t even—I really want to tell you some of the good ones because I think you would appreciate them, but I almost can’t say them because I don’t know if we have any kids under 18 listening to the podcast.

But I did. It might start with a P word that you might have already referenced earlier in the podcast. So if anybody rewinds it, we could talk about it. It’s bigger than courses, from what we understand, but it’s free if you go and find it on websites.

But I used to have some phenomenal ones. I mean, I would buy them just because I thought they were funny. Like, I bought—I’m just gonna tell you, I mean, it’s my podcast—like, “famine” or something. I used to own “Mr. Meatstraw”—that was one. And I just bought it because… and I used to own “MuchoBooty.” MuchoBooty. I thought it was hilarious. There was nothing—I never put anything on there. It was just these domains.

And I would, like, go way down the rabbit tunnel and find something like “MuchoBooty,” and I’d start laughing like you did. I’m like, I’m buying it. And then I’d go home and tell my wife, “Hey, I just bought MuchoBooty.” And she goes, “What are you buying MuchoBooty for?” And I’m like, “I don’t know, just in case somebody wants to get it one day.”

And I kind of thought, oh, I can sell these. And I’ve only sold one domain name, actually—and it was an influencer domain name that I did sell for a good little chunk of change—but everything else? So I was paying $10 a year at that point for 500 domains. That’s like five grand a year. And my wife’s like, “You’re gonna build out 500 websites?” And I go, “Maybe. Maybe this weekend. Maybe I’ll just have a crazy idea, smoke some weed, and go ahead and put up 500 domains.” And it never happened. So I never did that.

But now I probably own 30 or 40. So I went to rehab. I’ve been a good boy. I haven’t gone crazy. I mean, I have a few that I probably don’t need. And then all the other ones that I thought were funny—like, I bought “HowIBrokeMyBackMountain.com,” right? Because I thought it was going to be, like, gay porn. You know, because—remember Brokeback Mountain? So I thought—there were all kinds. I think I just… I would buy them and laugh.

It was literally like $10 for humor. I was like, why go to a comedy club when I can just go look up these domain names? I had a lot of them. I have to find the old list, because I’ll look at them every once in a while and I’m like, “Oh, you’re so funny, Shane.” It’s like, oh, so fun.

Now, I’m telling you, I really probably could have done something with them, you know, at least. But I wasn’t really looking to make them into porn sites, because I was more affiliate stuff, which I did affiliate stuff. It was just—I liked them. Like, I really didn’t have plans on building out all of them, and they weren’t all porn-related, but I was really for humor. Like, I literally would just—and then I wouldn’t let them go, because I was like, “Well, somebody’s gonna go buy MuchoBooty if I get rid of it.” Well, that’s kind of the premise. Like, you don’t own it, really, you know, it’s like somebody else buys it. So there’s only been—I mean, like I said, I sold a good one in the influencer space. That was a chunk of change that I went back and forth with the guy and got a good little deal out of it. So you know, that was—I don’t know if it paid for all my hosting for the 10 years on names, give or take, a few bucks here and there.

You know, it’s—this is like counseling. Kind of like, that’s the podcast—is counseling for me. So I leave like, “Okay, yeah, I have a problem still.” So that’s good to know. Thanks for confirming that. By the way, Cat, you’re a team player. You are a team player. That’s it. No, it takes a team. So what other cool projects are you working on these days? So obviously, you have the one that you’re in the middle of right now in regards to the invoice, Pay the Invoice. You got any other—and I know you just said that you’re like, literally on restriction right now. So I don’t know if you can, even if you’d bring up a new project that hasn’t happened, I think you’re gonna probably get your hand slapped. But let’s—if nobody’s listening to this, and maybe we’ll—maybe we’ll put this out three months or something, so you can talk about a project you want to do. But is there anything cool you got going on?

Yeah, literally, yeah. I have so many other things to say. I mean, that you just like, I was like, I felt like we were playing softball, and you just threw the ball to me. And I’d like, this bad. I’m just like, is this gonna be a home run? Oh, I think it is. So, you know, it’s funny, I had a company, and I can’t remember them, and I get a lot of leads on my website, but I had a lady that reached out to me about something similar, and I remember thinking, and I did a call with her, and just for me, I was like, I just not that. I don’t know enough about the female parts, right? We don’t have the heavy into my research I’ve done there, but I will tell you that it was just, it just was something that was outside of when I was like, I just don’t know if I could really help you, like, you know, I’m not. I mean, I get it, but it’s like, I’m not. I’ve done my research, but I’m married now, so I don’t do tons more research. I’m pretty, I’m pretty retired at this point, but it’s interesting. I think that’s going to be an interesting space for you, for sure. I think you know, I mean, obviously that’s the… mean thing that women deal with. So I think it’s you know, if you can figure out how to do it. And I do know, because I’ve worked in a lot of niches where you can’t do Facebook ads right, especially well now, now they’re not doing anything in regards to weight loss, but when I’ve done like fitness and stuff like that, it’s real difficult any before and after pictures or anything that can potentially offend anybody in the world at any point, at any time, can’t be a Facebook ad, which I always thought was kind of interesting. It’s like, we’re not really telling everybody that they’re fat. We’re just saying, Look what you can do. And they’re like, Yeah, but she was one picture when she’s fat and when she’s skinny. And I’m like, I never said she was fat in that picture. You said that. I’m like, why would you judge her? Like, that? You know, not really. But obviously Facebook’s not going to take the time and, you know, talk to me about that. But, yeah, there’s, you know, that, and the cannabis space, and I think there’s some really interesting places where it’s like you got to think outside the box.

We might do. We’ve got another conversation. Yeah, I might own that, by the way. It might be a picture of just my brother at the US getting a little get a little glove check. Don’t worry. I’ll only heard for a minute, sir, don’t look back at us. Please. Don’t look back. It’s probably better to look forward…

Yeah, my brother. Do know my brother, that’s awesome. That’s a whole nother story. But so I also saw that—like this—I was looking at your Instagram probably, I mean, I’m not really say stalking, but doing research, as some other people put it. You did a cryotherapy right to just do, like, something I go, how was that? I had like, so there’s one that opened up, like, right around the corner from my house. And I’ve driven by there, I’ve talked to like, two people that have done it and they like it. What was your like? How did you—did you like it? Or what were you thinking?

Yeah, that’s it. Yeah. You’re quite the salesperson. You’re like, no, it’s murder. I mean, I’d rather die or cut my legs off, and I liked it, but I liked it. You should try it. I’m like, that’s like when people eat food, they’re like, God, this tastes like shit here. Try something. I’m like, why? Why would I want to do that? Why would I like, I’m just gonna take your word for it. Like, I’ll just put it like, I’ll just put it on my list of things not to eat in the future, and we don’t need it. I don’t think I got to test it.

I’ll send you some DMs of me and my cryotherapy session. Okay, it’s interesting. Okay? Because I’m a runner as well. So that’s really why—that’s the only reason I thought about it is because my knees, you know, I’m my 40s now, so it’s that they’re not quite as forgiving as they were when I was young and agile. And, you know, it is what it is.

Yeah. See, that’s me too. I’m like, “Hey,” and this is a funny straw material history—you will appreciate this. You’ll appreciate this as somebody that just tries anything. So, my brother used to live on Haight-Ashbury in San Francisco, and there was something with my back. I’ve had a little bit of back issues, just because I used to do boxing and I did CrossFit. And anyway, long story short, I’ve always been—I played like footy. You know footy? You ever heard of footy? Soccer? No. Footy is like, it’s like rugby, but it’s like Australian.

Okay, of course you have to be—yeah, yeah. It’s like rugby. So anyway, I’ve gotten beat up over the years, right? And it’s okay, I’m okay with that. So now I’m, like, doing Pilates with six-year-old women, which is… it’s kind of like, I’m usually fifth and sixth gear, and now I’m in first gear. And I’m like, “All right, put your legs up in tabletop,” and I’m like, “Oh my gosh.”

But the funny part about this—this thing—was, there was a guy that was supposed to be like, a shaman, and my brother was having friends that would come by, and he wanted to—he’s like, “Oh, I can heal your back. Tell your brother to come on in.” So this is, once again, Haight-Ashbury. So let me—you know, San Francisco, no drug use, I’m sure. No, I’m sure nobody was on drugs when we were doing this.

And the guy gets behind me and he’s like hhhehhhhh. Like this sound—and I kind of jumped, because I’m like, “Oh snap,” because he’s behind me, right? And he’s doing some weird magic stuff. So it was so bad because, once again, I was like, “I’ll try anything once. Let’s just, you know, give this guy a chance,” right?

And he does this weird, like—I thought he was maybe having a baby, or like a gremlin was coming out of his stomach or something. I can’t look at him. He was doing this weird—my brother was laughing, and my mom was there—my mom was laughing. They both had to leave the room, and I had to continue the session with this guy for like an hour. Finally, I was like, “I don’t know how he yelled that long.” Like, it was a visceral growl from the innards, yeah.

And so, you know—so once again, I’ll try anything once. I don’t know if I’m gonna do the heavy shaman work from white guys with dreads, but I tried it. And I can take it off the list, I guess is what I’m telling you.

I didn’t want to bring it up, but I was like, “You know what? I’m gonna send you a little wish list, and you just go ahead and take, put out whatever you want on there, and I’ll just go ahead and buy me a few things and send it out here to California.” So I’m gonna—we got one last question for you. This is the one that really kind of perplexes people, because I really come hot and heavy on the last question. So if I was to give you a lottery ticket—now we’ve kind of done where there were time with lottery ticket again, and you’re the future. So we can figure this out. But if I was gonna give you a winning lottery ticket, right, for ten million, what would you use that money on?

Yeah, that’s awesome. Yeah, awesome. Well, I’m hoping I win, because I would love to—I’d love to chip in for that. I think that’s the Maslow’s hierarchy of needs, right? It’s, like, the basic things that a lot of people don’t have. And I think we just all over the world, we don’t realize, like, how lucky we have it, you know, with things that we do have—you know, here in the US, or wherever you’re located. And it’s like, you really have to understand, like, there’s people that don’t have the basics. The stuff that we every morning, we go and grab our little $5 coffee and go do my Pilates, and I complain about this, that, and the other. It’s like you have nothing to complain about at the end of the day. Like, life is good. You know, life is good.

For sure, yeah. For sure. You should always treat people…

I mean, I was like, hello, to be number one. But I gave her—I know we were, like, fighting with number one and number two—like, take care of people.

For sure. I didn’t want to, I didn’t want to bring that up, but I think this is going to be the spiciest podcast that I’ve ever done. I don’t know if it’s going to get much spicier with everybody else. And the cool part is, I’m actually going to send out this podcast to everybody before I go and interview them, and say this is kind of the premise of the podcast. We usually talk heavy—drugs, orgasms, dildos. It’s usually pretty popular. And I just want to see where you’re at mentally, so we’re just gonna have conversations. And if you haven’t stripped in the past, it’s probably not a good podcast for you. Okay, sounds good. Thank you so much for the potential of interviewing me. Shane—yeah, yeah. Cat, you were an absolute angel. But seriously, I love the transparency, I love the energy, everything about you. You’re a soldier, and I appreciate you.

Thank you. Really good to be on here.

Awesome. Cat, you have an awesome rest of your day. Thank you so much for being on the podcast.

All right. Obviously, we’ll talk soon.