Unveiling the Ultimate Content Marketing Plan with Julia McCoy

Welcome to the podcast. I’m Shane Barker, your host of the Shane Barker’s Marketing Madness podcast. Today, we’re going to discuss content marketing strategies. My guest, Julia McCoy, is the founder and CEO of Express Writers, a content writing agency that has served over 5,000 clients. She’s also the author of two bestsellers, So You Think You Can Write and Practical Content Strategy and Marketing. Additionally, she serves as an educator at contentstrategiescourses.com. I always like to start the podcast with some general questions about where you grew up and that kind of thing, just so we can get an idea of who you are today. Because it seems like you’re starting a new business every week! Every time I look at your profile, it’s something new. I love that. I can’t even keep up with you! But let’s start with where you grew up. Where did you grow up? Not, obviously, not in Austin, right? You grew up somewhere else?

Yeah, Austin. I just went there, and I had so much fun. I almost got an Austin tattoo on my neck. I mean, that’s how much fun I had. Yeah, fun. There are other parts of my body I could have gotten it, but why not my neck? Then people could see it, and it would show my dedication to Austin. So, to my wife’s satisfaction, I didn’t get it. So, we’re good. We’re still good. Next time, you never know. You never know, especially when you have as much fun as I did and meet the cool people out there. Nothing but a good time for sure.

Well, cool. So how big was your family?

Gotcha, so you loved him, but secretly, maybe not hated him, but you were like, “Oh, I gotta watch him again. I could have been free tonight if I didn’t have little Johnny in my life,” right? Probably, yeah, I get that. I get it. About 18 years in, though, it’s interesting. After 18 years, you’re like, “Hey, let’s do it again.”

I do not know this. I—okay, I have goosebumps. Like, literally, I would—and I wasn’t trying to pull this out of you. I literally was just like, “Oh, cool, kind of tell me about what’s on the outside. Oh, that’s cute.” I was like, “Go get her book, please. People still buy the book, but give us—oh, God, this is juicy already.” Like, I don’t even know. I don’t even need coffee. Okay, so, this is why I called it the Marketing Madness podcast. Because if this were content that converts, it wouldn’t be as—political marketing madness, madness, potentially in the middle. So, tell me about this 21, and you escaped. Good Lord.

You weren’t allowed to wear pants.

Yeah, do not do that. Okay, got it.

So, literally, you suppressed this kind of stuff up until 21, and that’s probably why you start a business every two hours. All that creativity was pent up for 21 years, and now you’re like, the world is your oyster, and you’ve absolutely taken advantage of that. It’s funny. I look at the questions, and they are very leading. You would think I knew that’s where we were going with this, but I was absolutely clueless. That was not the goal of this. When you said that, I was like, “Wow, hello, right hand turn on a Friday.” I’m like, super interesting. I’m gonna move around a little bit. So, when’s your book coming out about this?

This has nothing to do with—I mean, it has everything to do with your life. So, you’re just talking about your journey. It’s not really about your business, but maybe it helped shape your business and how it helped you, you know, personally.

God, that is so crazy. Like I’m I don’t even know, like, I had all these fun questions, all this stuff, and now that’s just like that. Just like, blew me away. Like I don’t even know how to where to go from here.

You know, to me, I think that’s awesome that you shared that with us because it’s a very personal thing, right? And you’re obviously writing a book about it. But to me, it’s awesome that you were willing to share that. I mean, for me, that’s just—it’s crazy. As a kid, obviously, you don’t know any different. You just think that’s the way things are. You don’t have anything to compare it to. And in those situations, they don’t want you to compare it to anything. They want you to think it’s the norm. Exactly. It’s just such an intriguing story. Of course, if you hadn’t started all these businesses and we didn’t have 10,000 other things to talk about, I’d continue on. But, I thought, “This was about marketing,” and I’d say, “Don’t worry about it, go to the next podcast.” So cool. We’ll jump into some other things here. It’s so funny. The next question was going to be, “Can you tell me an interesting fact about you growing up?” Well, I think we’ve already taken care of that one, right?

But I didn’t— that is too funny. I literally wasn’t trying to probe you into saying anything. I had no idea this would come up, like, anything like this. It was totally out of left field, but I’ll take it, right? (Sorry again!) No, no, I don’t think there’s anything to apologize for. I think it’s awesome that you’re willing to bring that up. And the cool part is that you’re writing a book about it. I mean, there’s something very freeing about that—to be able to talk about the things that happened there. It sounds like it was a very delicate situation, so the fact that you brought it up with me, I think of it as an honor.

Yeah, actually, I do know a little bit about your college experience. So, why don’t we talk about that a little bit? You decided to go to college—was this at the same time you were running your marketing company or your content company? Or give me a little background there.

Yeah, it’s really weird to me that, you know, they cut you off from the whole world, but yet they give you the internet. Yeah, which is a gift, yes. Because you’d think maybe they didn’t really understand the magnitude of the internet or how much it opens up your eyes. But it also sounds like the internet— not that the internet “saved” you; that might be a strong term—but at least it made you realize there was something bigger out there, right? It kept that alive for you. So, that’s really interesting to me, because we used the internet at a younger age too, and so did my brother. My brother had gotten into some trouble. I don’t mean this in a bad way, like, you know, crazy, like with the police, but he was on chat rooms and stuff like that. There was some weird stuff, you know, all that kind of fun stuff. But the internet was definitely a cool, fun place. It could also get a little shady too. I mean, it’s not that it’s changed much. There’s still plenty you can find in dark chat rooms where you can do all kinds of weird stuff and feel whatever it is.

Yeah, the dark web sounds so scary, but that’s interesting. So, the internet was kind of like your access to the outside world. You still had access to the internet, and that kind of kept you going, you know? You go to nursing school, and my wife is a nurse. I’ve been raised by nurses—let me tell you this. My wife has been a nurse for 35 years, and my mom was a nurse for 34 years. So, I was around nurses all the time. I’m like, you know, I have my little germ obsession. I’m not a nurse, by any means, but I definitely know what’s dirty. I probably wash my hands 10 times a day—after anything. Eating, doing anything, I always wash my hands. I was raised in a germ-conscious family, thanks to nurses. So, when I was older, I said to my wife, who was in sales at the time, “I really think I want to be a nurse.” My wife has such a big heart. She’s an amazing person, and her bedside manner is off the charts. She gets awards for it. And I’m not saying that to brag, I’m just saying she’s a great person, and she really cares about people. The nursing profession is a giving one. But it’s interesting that halfway through your nursing journey, you were just like, “Hey, you know what? I don’t know if this is my calling.” Just because you wanted to be a nurse since you were four doesn’t mean that when you’re 19, it’s still the same thing, right?

Yeah, but that’s interesting. You’re going through school, and you kind of realize, like, wait a second, there are only nine other U.S. writers in this freelance world. I could be number 10 and then take over the number one spot, as we all know. But that’s awesome. It’s kind of cool. So, it’s funny. When I say that I’m a writer, I use that term in the loosest way possible. I’m like, at the bottom level of writers. I mean this seriously, like, at the very bottom. People like you, you guys write books and stuff. I write a solid one-pager, but after two pages, I get a PhD, and I look around and think, “We should be taking more of your courses, to be honest.” But thank goodness I have a good team of writers. So, anyway, shout out to my team for dealing with me. But okay, cool. So, with the college thing, you jumped out a little early. When did you start Express Writers? Was that in 2012, like you mentioned?

And today’s Express Writers, forward thinking, and you added the “S”, that’s good. Guaranteed there’s going to be more than just me one day.

And at McDonald’s, you were like, didn’t you train there, like a crew trainer or something like that? (Yes, yeah.) It’s funny. You know that my team knows gets deep. “I’m Jay.” We know. We didn’t know about the whole, the whole thing you had going on before 21 but anything after that, we are on top of it. So just, you know, I know everything at this point.

And then we’ll have a second interview. I’ll have all kinds of other new questions. Tell the world, tell the world. So cool. So, you were doing the McDonald’s thing, and then obviously there’s that moment where you’re like, “Hey, something’s got to give. I’m making more money doing the writing thing, the freelance thing.” And it’s so funny because I’ve worked with thousands—well, not thousands, maybe thousands—of writers, and I always say, if you do good work and you’re on time, you’re beating out 60% of the people out there, 70%, right? It’s one of those crazy things. Anyways, I know, as you know, it’s always hard to find good writers, and then when you do, you do everything in your power to hold onto them, to keep them on the bus somehow, right? Keep them happy, because good people who are passionate are great writers. It’s just awesome. It’s awesome when you have that kind of team. So, congratulations on that. So, about 2012 is when you started doing that, when you brought on Express Writers, or Writer, and then Writers after you doubled up and found some other people and started working on stuff. This whole time, were you married? When did you get married? Just out of curiosity, with Josh, right?

So just reeling it in here, folks.

So he clicked on that profile. He’s like, man, we got a beauty. Got brains too. We got a reeler in! Good Josh, you little sneaky little bastard. I love it, all right! Awesome.

You know it, and it worked.

So that’s what happened—stranger danger. But it’s not stranger danger after two weeks, right? This could have been, you could have not been on this podcast, because, who knows? I’m not saying everything happens for a reason, but you guys are awesome. You got married, and everything’s cool. So, nothing but good stuff, but I just think it’s interesting. After two weeks, you’re like, “Listen, Josh is way better than my current situation.” So, Josh, you know you’re going to hire me, but I’m also going to live with you for a little bit, and then eventually, we’ll get married and start a family. No pressure.

Yeah, there really is. I mean, I’m a firm believer in that. It’s like, when you see those kinds of things, because if you explain this story to really anybody, they’d go, “That’s crazy.” Yeah, that’s just the craziest thing ever. But I also think people truly understand that connection. Some people have it instantly, some people it takes time, but there are some people who have it. I know couples that have been together for 50 years, like, “Oh, we met, I went and proposed two weeks later, and we’re married.” And I’m not saying that’s crazy because it worked for them, right? It doesn’t work for everybody. You could be with somebody for five years, get married, and then get divorced in two years. I get that. There’s no right or wrong, or rhyme or reason to these things, except the fact that you’re like, “Hey, I feel this in my heart,” and he felt it in his heart, and you’re like, “Hey, I’m going to move in. I’m escaping a cult.” He says, “Hey, why not come into my house, and let’s rock on?” That’s crazy. My Friday is, like, forever going to be, the rest of my days, like, listening to this podcast I did today.

That’s why I did it. You were—you might move without even knowing that you were the reason I did this because before, kind of, the concept was like, “Oh, it’s content, and we can talk about different stuff,” and I was like, “Oh, it’ll be fun,” but this is it. Like, the madness part for me was really important. My team was like, “Oh, but madness sounds crazy,” and I’m like, “Have you listened to the podcast?” Okay, right? Sometimes we go to the right and the left, and I’m sure when I took it earlier, you were like, “Little does he know, alright, what I have planned for him. Wait till I bring up Josh in the cult.” I’m like, man, talking about this kind of stuff gets me up in the morning. This is awesome. Okay, it can’t get any better than this, and we’re only half an hour into this thing, and I’m like, man, I’m doing backflips in my chair, which I’m doing podcasts, so nobody would know. They’d probably hear me or something like that if I did. But okay, so let’s—I don’t even know where to go from this. I mean, at this point, I’m not saying anything else we talk about isn’t going to be exciting, but I just feel like we’re like, “Okay, now we’re going to talk about content and other websites.” Tell me about beyond the cult and Josh and how you guys met. I mean, we’re good. I mean, this thing’s sizzling right now. Alright, we’re going to switch gears a little bit. If we have to bring back in the cult, we can. I have no problems with that whatsoever. So, how did—what was that transition? Okay, you have Express Writers, right? So, you’re starting that up. You and Josh get together. Josh is kind of the CTO, is that correct? Does he help with a lot of the—? Yes. Okay, awesome. So, you’re maybe the writer, obviously running the teams and stuff, and he helps with building the websites and the courses and all that fun stuff. Is that kind of a good assessment?

Yeah, that’s crazy. So, it’s so funny. I mean, I have a team, and we do some of that stuff. I’m not a huge fan—like, putting courses together and all that. I can do it, and I’ve done it for clients, but it’s just not something I enjoy. On the opposite side, I’m also not someone who wants to write all day. I’m like, “Ooh, don’t want to do that either.” For me, it’s like, I enjoy speaking, and I like hanging out with people. Not just hanging out all the time, but you know, I enjoy the interaction with folks. Shaking hands and kissing babies is my thing—I really, really enjoy that. I’m trying to do more of that, traveling and all that, because it ties back into the business and drives revenue. But I enjoy that side of it. I’m not a huge fan of the course creation and all that. Like, if I had to actually go in and put that stuff together, shout out once again to my team that can put those kinds of things together. I just look at it and say, “Okay, that sounds good. We can change some things around.” But I am definitely not the heavy, heavy technical side. Even hosting—without my guys, something’s going on with the hosting account and I’m like, “Can somebody figure it out?” Because I’m just not. I go in, and I try to look at it, and I’m like, “Oh man, I’m going to end up taking down the whole internet by clicking the wrong button.” I try to stay away from it. I’m okay—about 10% good—but I get to a realm where I’m like, “I just can’t do that anymore.” So, shout out to Josh again. Josh is the man. He’s got, like, a Superman cape on at this point. He comes in, saves you, keeps your stuff together, and makes Julie look awesome.

Yeah. Josh with the win, Josh, with the W right now, this is awesome. I’m a huge fan. Tell Josh, Shane says, Hi.

We will. We definitely will. So okay, so tell me about your first book. So your first book was the So You Think You Can Write Right? Which I think I had a little foreword in there –

I didn’t want to bring it up, but I was an early adapter, folks. I was in there in the book early. Didn’t know about all the details of the cold and stuff like that, which wouldn’t have changed the decision or anything that I wrote in that book. I still love Julia with all my heart. So tell us about the book. Tell us what we got going on there.

But that’s the thing. But you, that’s what you enjoy, right? So, I mean, it’s like, but the thing is, I can tell with your personality, but it’s not like you. You’re like an introvert and can’t hold the conversation like, that’s the I could tell you have a very great personality on video and stuff. You can’t be on video and be like an introvert and not be to look at the camera. You know what I’m saying. So you’ve, I don’t know if you’ve had to break out of that when you used to be that way.

So really, so you had to kind of, like, break that mold of, like..

Yeah, that’s crazy. So, it’s so funny. I mean, I have a team, and we do some of that stuff. I’m not a huge fan—like, putting courses together and all that. I can do it, and I’ve done it for clients, but it’s just not something I enjoy. On the opposite side, I’m also not someone who wants to write all day. I’m like, “Ooh, don’t want to do that either.” For me, it’s like, I enjoy speaking, and I like hanging out with people. Not just hanging out all the time, but you know, I enjoy the interaction with folks. Shaking hands and kissing babies is my thing—I really, really enjoy that. I’m trying to do more of that, traveling and all that, because it ties back into the business and drives revenue. But I enjoy that side of it. I’m not a huge fan of the course creation and all that. Like, if I had to actually go in and put that stuff together, shout out once again to my team that can put those kinds of things together. I just look at it and say, “Okay, that sounds good. We can change some things around.” But I am definitely not the heavy, heavy technical side. Even hosting—without my guys, something’s going on with the hosting account and I’m like, “Can somebody figure it out?” Because I’m just not. I go in, and I try to look at it, and I’m like, “Oh man, I’m going to end up taking down the whole internet by clicking the wrong button.” I try to stay away from it. I’m okay—about 10% good—but I get to a realm where I’m like, “I just can’t do that anymore.” So, shout out to Josh again. Josh is the man. He’s got, like, a Superman cape on at this point. He comes in, saves you, keeps your stuff together, and makes Julie look awesome. That is it. You know, that’s with anything. That was like what we do exactly. And obviously, I know you speak as well. I’ve done that. And even now, I’ve talked a little bit about this in past podcasts, just about, you know, getting anxiety a little bit before you go up on stage and kind of that nervous energy. But I know some people like the idea of speaking, like you say, “Hey, when you go speak on stage, I would rather fight the Taliban with a butter knife,” something like that, which I’ve never, I wouldn’t try to do that. I don’t think I would recommend that. But what I’m saying is, like, you know, people really— for me, I feel like I do good on stage. I feel like I can always do better. There’s always that next level. But, you know, if people knew the anxiety or what I feel before I go on stage, you wouldn’t know it. And I’m, once again, telling everybody this, almost losing my mind. I’m on the outskirts of like… but you wouldn’t know. When I get on stage, I feel like I still have other than I talk fast, but I just naturally talk fast. But I think it’s one of those weird things where, like, right before, in fact, I had a guy—when I was going on Ontraport, when I spoke at one of their events, the keynote that I did over there, they actually told me— the guy in the back was like, “Hey, how you doing?” I was like, “Oh, I’m doing good,” which is a total lie. I’m not, you know, mentally, I’m like, “Oh my god, am I gonna lose my mind? Am I gonna pass out?” Like, all these things are going through my head, 19 different things. And he goes, “Hey, are you doing it?” “I’m doing good.” And he goes, “You know what? I have a buddy, man, who says he takes a shot or two of tequila before he goes on stage every time, and now he’s been doing it for five years or whatever, and he’s totally good.” And so now, it’s in my head, I’m like, “Should I drink some tequila? Should I have had a few shots before I got up on stage?” Which I haven’t done yet. I don’t know if I’m going to, I don’t know if that’s going to be in the mix, but it is interesting, the different types of fears I have. So, I’ve talked about this as well. Like, I have some students, because I teach at UCLA, I have some students—and what I’m telling you a story about is talking about overcoming things. And the video thing, obviously, you did eight minutes, and it took you, like, 38 hours or whatever it was, to be able to get enough good content for that. My first blog post, I still have that on my website, and I show it to my students. And I go, “Do you think this blog post is good?” And they’re like, “Oh my god, that’s terrible.” And I go, “It is. It’s absolutely terrible. In fact, I should probably de-index it. I should probably get rid of it.” But at the end of the day, I want to show them that was the point where I started. Yeah, you don’t have to be a Julie-style writer to be able to—you know, it was like, just getting started. And the same thing with you with video—like, you’re looking at this thing, “Oh my god, this is 38 hours,” and Josh is like, “Man, this is not going good, right? We’ve got 38 hours of footage here. We’ve got to really cut this thing down.” You got started, though, and you did that. I think overcoming that is, for a lot of people, very difficult. But I look at like, with speaking, I look at like, every time I go on stage, I’m 1% better, right? So I’ve got to do 100 times to be able to get that. For you, video—once again, hey, the video guy, that sucks. That was 38 hours of drama, stress, whatever you had to go through. But now you’re doing the video, you know, a day, right? And it’s like, you take 20 minutes, and you kind of get the content together. Now you just knock it out. So I just think it’s interesting. Like, well, I mean, you’re like, the poster child of pushing through and, like, you know, breaking out of things and doing things that you feel uncomfortable with, like leaving cults and stuff like that, right? I mean, that’s, yeah, I mean, that’s not… I mean, we’ve all had our typical Friday activity this weekend. And probably, to bring up the cult, I’m probably gonna have some people pull up in a black vehicle or something. But it’s okay. This is my last podcast. I want to thank you, Julia, for being my last guest. I do appreciate it. So, let’s jump to your second book. So, you have another one called Practical Content Strategy and Marketing, right? And that was, that’s correct, the end of 2017? So, tell us a little bit about that book. What was it for? I mean, other than you’re saying, “Hey, listen, if you want to do content marketing,” and you kind of probably give out a lot of the secrets in the way you were successful and stuff like that. Give us a little background on that book.

This just in folks. No, seriously, sit down. Or she’s telling you that she’s a workaholic, Josh. Have to schedule time to see each other. Like, just tell me, like, is it like Tuesday? Like Tuesday between 8:30 we’re gonna have coffee together.

So, does he know when he has to get you from the computer? Have you ever scratched him or anything like that when you’re typing, and then he’s like, “Alright, honey, we need to go,” and you’ve scratched him? And I’m not saying aggressively, I’m just saying maybe like a pure reaction, like a cat, you know, where it’s like, “Get off, I’m working?”

Okay, I see that. I see that. I kind of like that. So it’s kind of like a warning. It’s like a warning shot, like “Hey, if you go and grab my keyboard or my arm. I will, I will scratch your eyes out, Josh.”

Not today, Josh, not today. Josh, that’s interesting. So, we do have some common traits in multiple ways. I used to be a crazy workaholic like you. I don’t think you’re recovering by any means—I think you’re still there. I used to work crazy 16-20 hours a day. I mean, I had another business that was very, well, I say very time-intensive. When you own your business, it’s always time-intensive. So, to say that I had to work 20 hours is an absolute lie because I could have worked 12, and it wasn’t like I was doing brain surgery where people were gonna die if I didn’t show up to work. But the workaholic thing for me, I’m now in recovery in the sense that I have a team, and I’ve learned to delegate and do some things. I’m not saying you don’t delegate because I know you have a big team. But I’ve learned to, like, I don’t know, just try to even that out a little more because I was really, really, really bad. I mean, I was 30 pounds overweight, I wasn’t eating well, living off energy drinks—just a lot of stuff that was really bad. But I’ve kind of changed that. And I’m not saying you need to change that because you enjoy writing. You’re phenomenal at it, and you really enjoy, like, going to that next level. And I do too. But it’s funny, it’s tapered off a little bit for me. You know, I mean, I still have 1,000 projects and there’s a lot of stuff, but for you, I would say, compared to me, you seem a lot more focused. Maybe you’re not, maybe it’s just the way it seems, but like, I could imagine you when you’re like, “I’m going to get this project done. It’s gonna take three weeks.” I mean, I could imagine it’s like, you know, even the dogs looking at you like, “Hey, are we gonna walk this week?” I kind of feel like you’d forget about me if you’re there, writing, and the keyboard’s on fire. “What do we do? Do we need a fire extinguisher or something?” So, but that’s awesome, though. I think it’s great to be that driven, but then also to have that kind of focus, that laser focus. It’s difficult for me. I mean, I can focus on things, but I can’t, like, if I had to sit down and do like, “Hey, this whole weekend, you’re gonna write 200 pages,” that’s not gonna happen. There’s not enough medication from a pharmacy that could get me focused. But I think you seem like you’re just hyper-focused. Is that kind of your personality?

Yeah, that’s true. The hardest part is just starting, right? I mean, when we talk about UCLA and students, the key is to just do it. Perfection isn’t the goal. If you’re waiting for everything to be perfect, you’ll never launch. It’s so true. A lot of people worry about failure—what will people think, and all that. But the fact that you can disconnect from that is impressive. I mean, there’s probably still some part of you that wants it to succeed, but you’re okay if it doesn’t. It’s kind of funny. The way you think reminds me of when I go to a casino. I go with a set amount of money, say $1,000, and I know upfront I might lose it. But if I win, great! If not, no big deal. I’m there for the experience. I think it’s a great way to approach things in business too. People are scared to fail, but failure only matters if you don’t learn anything from it. Like, in business, if your first course doesn’t make a million dollars, that’s fine. Most people’s first attempts fail. The key is to learn and improve. Same with speaking—if I keep practicing, I get 1% better each time. People ask me how to succeed, and I tell them: fail as many times as possible. It’s about learning and growing. Sure, you wouldn’t want to fail as a brain surgeon, but for everything else, it’s part of the process. I have a client, Chris Ruden, who’s starting a company called Fail Forward. The idea is, even when you fail, you’re moving forward. Failure isn’t something to fear. As long as you learn something from it, it’s a step in the right direction. You’re putting yourself out there, which is what most people are afraid to do. There’s always judgment when you put your work out for the world to see, but the fact is, you’re doing it. And I think that’s amazing. A lot of people criticize without ever taking the step themselves. It’s great to see someone with your mindset—putting work out there without worrying about perfection. So many people are stuck in that perfectionism trap, but you know it’s about progress. As the saying goes, “The only way to fail is to not try.” That mindset is key to moving forward, and I love that you embrace it. I think this is why I love doing the podcast. It lets me get to know people, and now we’re going to be BFFs and hang out in Austin. I’ll bring the wife, we’ll have a great time. So, what else are you passionate about? Obviously, writing, but what else? Writing’s probably number one, right? Or is it writing, Josh, and the dog?

No, it’s not. So you’re talking about more like long-tail keywords that you’re like, “Wait a second, this is something that the big dogs haven’t already taken on, that you’re not gonna be able to push them out of the way, but you’re like, listen, as a medium dog coming up to the big dogs, this is something where I can jump in that spot.” So I get it. I know that’s the keyword side of things. And, you know, SEO and that kind of thing is definitely a science. I’m with you on when you find a long-tail keyword, you’re like, search volume, not a lot of competition—you’re like, super excited, you know? And I go tell my wife, “Look at this,” and she’s like, “I’m a nurse, so I’m about your long-tail keyword.” I’m like, “No, it’s really exciting because I know.” I know, good luck with your loyalty, hopefully the content comes out. Cool, so what are your three favorite content marketing tools? Like, are there some tools that you’re like, “Oh, these are tools I can’t live without.” Like, what are those?

I usually don’t do this, but you can bring up four. I know I usually like really strict podcasts. I’m like, You know what? Listen here. I’m just, I’m gonna break the rules that I usually don’t, because usually we talk about just strictly marketing and content, like, I don’t ever break the rules. And go outside of that. Today, you can do four. Let’s go ahead. I want to make sure we leave the stretch that we’re having right now. So go ahead. We got two more tools.

And what was the name of that? So you’re you like, gave me some tools I’ve never heard of, which I love. So what was the name of that? I’m gonna look it up.

Awesome. Well, we’re going to include that, obviously, at the bottom of the podcast. We’ll do a little transcription of this whole thing and get that on there. I love the tools, because there are literally two that I’ve never heard of. So, I’m like, this is why it gets interesting. I can’t wait to test some of the headlines. They’re going to be like 7%, and I’m like, no, no. She might have changed one word, and it could have been 37%. So, tell me a little bit about your new project. What is it? Tell me, because I’ve done a little research, but coming from you, tell me what you’ve got going on there. What’s your plan with that? What’s the goal here? What are we doing?

Tell me more about this guy. Shane Barker, you’re gonna interview. I want to know about this guy. Yes! That’s what I’m talking about! Podcaster, podcast sweet trades, that’s what I’m talking about.

I was just gonna ask you that, like, how much did you pay for that? Like, you don’t have to give me a number, but how did you pull that off? Because I, trust me, I know. I used to own five to 600 domains, and my wife was like, “How are you gonna develop all those?” Then finally, there was one year where she was like, “I’m gonna—” not really, she didn’t say she was gonna leave me, but she was like, “I don’t understand why you’re—there’s only $10 a month until you have five or 600, and then it’s like, what are you doing with all this?” So I got rid of them. It’s not a habit anymore. But, like, tell me about Content Hacker. Like, how’d you get that?

It is. You know, it’s funny, I’ve only sold a handful of those domains, because I always tell my wife, “Oh, I’m gonna sell these domains, and we’re gonna retire. This is gonna be great.” And she’s like, “Yeah, sounds great.” And that just never happened. I sold one domain name for $7,000. Oh, wow, yeah. So, that was my claim to fame, but it literally happened, like, six months ago. Anything before that, I was losing my pants on buying domain names that I was gonna resell. It was just one of those things. Now, I look at them, and a lot of them were like, kind of funny ones. I’d buy them and laugh, like, I can’t even say what they were on the podcast. Some of them might have been a little inappropriate, but I was like, “Hey babe, I just bought this.” And she goes, “You have a sickness for buying domain names.”

Now, I’m at like, probably 40 or 50, maybe a little less now, but yeah, there was, I mean, anytime I had an idea, I would go and buy the domain names, and it was just—it was a sickness. But anyways, with private registration and all that, I was spending way too much money on private domain names. When I was like, “You can’t develop 500 websites.” I’m like, “Oh, I could. If I really focus, like Julia, watch me do it.” Oh yeah, I will. I swear to God, I’ll put up a site every four minutes. Never happened. My wife was right again. So, anyways, it happens. Alright, so we’re at the end of this thing. These last two questions are going to be really hard, so I just want to make sure we prep you for the big ones at the end. Oh, what did I know? I know, brace yourself. What is your favorite holiday destination spot? Like, where is the place where you’re like, “Josh and I want to go back to,” or “we’ve never been to,” where’s that spot?

Come on, sister hit me like, no, it could be, let’s talk.

So I’ve been to Thailand. I didn’t go to Chiang Mai, though. My brother and dad went there and said they had an awesome time. I was in Samui, and then I was in Bangkok, so I had a great time. Chiang Mai is definitely on my list. My dad and brother were there, so we were together, and then I had to go back to the US to get some stuff done. They just kept going, and they were like, “Oh, you missed out on this great spot.” And I was like, “Whatever. Screw you guys.” Now here I am back to work, and you guys are having so much fun. You’re getting a massage every three minutes, and it costs two bucks. And I’m like, “Oh, back home, so cool.” From Chiang Mai. And then, this is the last big question. If I won the lottery or something, right? And I’m like, obviously, Julia, since we’ve been friends for so long, I give you a card, and I say, “Here you go.” The card’s got, let’s say, $50,000 on it. You can max it out. Like, “Merry Christmas, Happy Birthday,” all that fun stuff. Where would you go? Where would you take that card, and where would you go to max out that credit card?

My God, I should have known. She’s not gonna like people who are like, “Oh, I would get an experience. I’d take some random kids here,” and you’re like, “No, Barnes & Noble, yeah, buy some books, folks.”

Yeah, Barnes and Noble. $50,000 a bar. You might keep it going. You might keep Barnes and Noble.

Julia Nobles, or something like that.

That’s it, once again, free books for Julia, just to make her happy. Well, Julia, this was awesome. This was, I mean, this is literally the reason why I have the podcast, because I just love this little hour of chatting with people, and you find out all kinds of interesting facts. Thank you for sharing the surprise. You’re still sitting down in one piece. Well, you don’t even know if I am sitting down. I might have fallen back up. I mean, at this point, it’s at this point, but I thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for being on the podcast. Let me know if you need any help with the near-future stuff you’ve got going on. I’m looking forward to content. (Yes, I’m looking forward to checking that out. You will hear from me) Alright, I can’t wait. I’ll be around. Cool, Julia. Have a great rest of your day.

Thanks.