Chad Pollitt is the Vice President and Co-Founder of Relevance, a digital magazine, agency, and events company dedicated to content research, strategy, and marketing. He is also the VP of Marketing at inPowered. He is an Adjunct Professor of Digital Marketing at the Kelley School of Business at Indiana University, of which he is a proud alumnus.
WEBSITE: Chad Pollitt
- The importance of content amplification
- How to use native advertising
- The future of content marketing
- An insider’s view of the digital marketing industry
- 4:51 : Fun Facts About Chad’s Childhood
- 9:40 : His Experience of Teaching at Universities
- 12:45 : Chad’s Entry into Digital Marketing
- 19:27 : Managing Multiple Projects at a Time
- 24:09 : Chad Talks About Content Amplification
- 29:08 : Benefits of Content Amplification
- 34:14 : Chad’s Recommended Software Solutions
- 38:15 : Ebooks Written by Chad
- 40:36 : Chad’s Passion for Cooking
- 42:17 : Chad Talks About His Bar
- 43:10 : What Chad Thinks About Marketing
Creating high-quality content is an integral part of growing an online business. However, even more important is the promotion of this content. You may have great content, however, if people don't get to see it, you won’t benefit from it.
This is where content amplification comes into play. It's the process of publishing content and then promoting and distributing it further to increase its reach.
Join me as I discuss the importance of content amplification with Chad Pollitt. He is the Vice President and Co-Founder of Relevance, and also serves as the VP of Marketing at inPowered. He is a published author, and he serves as an adjunct professor of digital marketing at the Indiana University Kelley School of Business.
Let's look at why content amplification is so important for succeeding online.
Why is Content Amplification Important?
Over 5 million blog posts are written on a daily basis. In such a huge crowd, it can be challenging to stand out. While unique and high-quality content can help you win the trust of your readers, the most difficult job is that of reaching the right readers. This is where content amplification can help you.
The decreasing organic reach on social media platforms such as Facebook has made it even tougher for you to reach your audience. This has forced business owners to turn towards paid advertising.
By increasing the exposure and reach of your content, you can increase the probability of getting more backlinks. This, in turn, can help improve your website’s SEO. High-quality content and backlinks can help you rank higher up in the Search Engine Results Pages (SERPs). This can get you more traffic, leads, and conversions.
So, essentially, by amplifying your content, you can optimize your SEO, promote your brand, and increase your brand mentions.
Now that you know why content amplification is important, let’s see how we you can do it.
How to Achieve Content Amplification
There are three media formats in which you can do content amplification. They are earned, paid, and owned media. It should be your goal to amplify your content in all of these forms of media.
Chad also mentions that you should figure out what you want to achieve as a marketer. You should determine what results you are expecting to get, such as:
- Increased engagement
- Increased leads
- More sales
- Increased traffic
- Increased conversions
- Increased backlinks
Let’s look at how you can do content amplification in each of these media types.
Owned media includes all of those media properties that are controlled and owned by you. These include things such as your website, social media profiles, and blog. You control these so you can oversee them and create all of the content for them.
The different methods of content amplification for owned media are:
- Email marketing
- Creating high-quality blog posts
- Publishing guest posts
Paid media encompasses all forms of advertising for which you directly pay. These include ads on social media and search engines. Facebook Ads, PPC, and retargeting are examples of this type of media.
To amplify your content in this type of media, you can do the following:
- Facebook Ads
- Instagram Ads
- Promoted Tweets
- Promoted Hashtags
- PPC through Google AdWords
- Influencer marketing
- Promoting content on LinkedIn
Earned media is the sort of media in which you get publicity for free. In this form of advertising, you can reach more people without a lot of effort from your end.
Here are the few forms of content amplification you can do in this form of media:
- Influencer marketing without any payments
- User-generated content
- Press coverage
Among the three, earned media is the one that you practically have no control over it. The entire decision of amplifying your content is dependent on others. In paid and owned media, all of the choices are up to you.
Let’s look at a few strategies for content amplification.
1. Amplify Your Best Content
Make sure that you amplify only your best content. Your best content has the best potential to grab people’s attention. You need to make sure that your content stands out from your competition.
Using content which isn’t up to the mark can, in fact, spoil your reputation. You need to showcase the best of what you’ve got so that those who see the content will naturally feel like promoting it further.
2. Utilize Influencer Marketing
Influencer marketing is a brilliant way of amplifying your content. In fact, as many as 92% of marketers believe that influencer marketing is effective. When you collaborate with influencers, you get direct access to their audiences. Their audiences are usually highly-engaged and follow their recommendations seriously.
The influencers will link to your content so their backlinks will also help improve your link profile. Additionally, some of their followers may link to your content or share it. This can further help spread the word about your brand and improve your link profile.
You may need to pay a fee to influencers to have them promote your brand. Some influencers may work on a barter basis.
3. Leverage Remarketing
One of the best ways of marketing your products is remarketing. You can use this feature for your PPC ads or social media ads. This method of marketing involves promoting your brand again to consumers who have shown interest in the past.
You can use targeting tools to further refine the target audience in the group you’re remarketing to. This can help improve your conversion rates.
Publishing great content is not enough anymore. You also need to promote and amplify it. Through paid, earned, and owned media, you can distribute your content across the internet.
You can use remarketing, influencer marketing, and content amplification to improve your brand’s reach and increase conversions. If you have any doubts regarding content amplification, you can reach out to me to discuss.
Shane Barker: Welcome to the podcast. I am Shane Barker, your host of Shane Barker's Marketing Madness podcast. Today, we're going to discussed Content Amplification. My guest, Chad Pollitt is a VP and Co-founder of Relevance. He also serves as a VP of Marketing at inPowered. He published three books to date and frequently talks about constant amplification. Listen to him is to give some expert tips on how to amplify your content and make the most of it. So cool, let's start off, like we'll just start with the basics, like, where did you grow up? Give us a little background about Chad. Where did little Chad grow up on me? Tell us a little bit about that. Chad Pollitt: So I grew up in Fort Wayne, Indiana. I grew up on the south east side. That quarter of the city is known as more or less a ghetto. I grew up very poor. I moved more times than what I can even count. I mean dozens of times. It was rough man, I grew up as a minority and my community which most people don't experience unless you are a minority. Shane Barker: So it's funny. I did mine was the same way. My growing up was, I grew up in South Sacramento and I was, when I was minority. I was there was very few white people up at that the elementary school... Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Shane Barker: ...that I went to, even the elementary school. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Shane Barker: So I'm very familiar with that and people who wouldn't know that about me but that is definitely one of the weird fun facts. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Same thing with me man, which by the way, I'm in San Fran every other week. So I'm over there sometimes around your stomping ground. So... Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: I definitely know it. But yeah, that's my past and you know what? I wouldn't have it any other way. Shane Barker: Yeah, me too. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Shane Barker: Yeah, it's kind of crazy when you talk about that. I think culturally it's interesting to grow up like that, I mean obviously wasn't only different right? Because that's the way that we grew up but I think looking back on it and having a different perspective on just how things in life and stuff like that. I think it has become like my wife always jokes around and she jokes around about herself in the sense that she says, "Hey, I can you know, I can dress up and be in a ball gown and go here or I can go and eat chicken wings and hang out and drink beers with the guys," you know. So it's like this kind of diversity thing that you see, you know, because of your background and so I feel the same way like with my background. I appreciate, I grew up I think a little tougher, it seems like I'm some tough guy but you know because I kind of had to like figure things out, right, as a little different. It wasn't quite as, every day was kind of a new challenge because I was going in and had to be, I mean for me having a quick tongue and being funny and you know, your mom jokes actually helped out a lot when people were coming to attack me. Then I would make fun of their mother and then they would say, "Wow that guy's pretty fast." I don't want to make fun of him anymore. So, that was, that was what got me through, you know. I was I was so skinny, man. I was like a hundred and ten grams in weight or something. Like I mean not even pounds. I was like just a frail little guy, right. And so you know, I had to learn kind of how to adapt, right. And this has nothing to do with Content Marketing, but I had to learn how to adapt right. How to like to muscle through and get through that and so it was interesting. But yeah, I wouldn't say have it any other way. So how big is your family? Like you obviously you guys sounds like you moved a lot. Where, was it a military family or no? Chad Pollitt: No, no. Shane Barker: No? Chad Pollitt: No military family. So I have twin daughters, they are nine years old. They're awesome, they are my little princesses. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: They're coming up, I'm trying to figure out that you know transferring to teenageness. Shane Barker: I'll pray for you man. Chad Pollitt: Yeah, yeah. But I'm working that, I live in Indianapolis. I bought a pretty big house. I have a 5-bedroom home. I take care of my parents. They stay with me. Shane Barker: Awesome. Chad Pollitt: My step-dad is handicapped, so he can't work. Then, my nephew, I take care of my nephew. His parents have issues, so I mean not to get into details, but they've been opioid addicts for a long time. Shane Barker: Oh no. Chad Pollitt: So I stepped in and I'm working through the state right now to get custody of my nephew. Shane Barker: Nice. Chad Pollitt: So that's something that's going on, but that's a side thing, family thing, but it's important for not just me, but for him and the rest of the family. Shane Barker: That's awesome. So it's funny, so you know, and I looked at obviously know your background and it's kind of crazy. I didn't think that there was going to be even more layers to your background and things that you do. So like right when I think that there's Chad up here, now there is better things that Chad can do to help other people's lives, you just, you've done 10 fold on that. So that's awesome. Chad Pollitt: Oh, thank you, I appreciate it. Shane Barker: Yeah, I mean it's a lot man. You're taking a lot and you got, with everything you got going online and then even offline it's kind of that's awesome if you're able to manage that. So tell us a like obviously, we know that you grew up as a minority being, you know, white in a probably African-American neighborhood or whatever the neighborhood was. Tell us an interesting fun fact, any interesting stuff that people would... Chad Pollitt: I had no idea. I mean do we even have enough time for that? Shane Barker: Like you don't have to disclose everything like, I don't you know, give us some fun stop. Chad Pollitt: Okay, I'm going to freak you out. I know fair and hopefully we don't freak out your audience. Shane Barker: That's too cold. Chad Pollitt: So I'm actually an award winning choreographer for Hip Hop and Step Dancing. Shane Barker: Shut the front door. That's why I ask these kind of questions because you just never know what people are going to come, keep going with this. We’re going to dig deep on this one. Chad Pollitt: So, my nickname in high school was ABC which stood for Another Bad Caucasian. And I was the trophy at the club that my dance group would throw out to punk somebody. Because I was a white guy that could dance. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: And I'd go out there and I would literally destroy everybody. I went to college, I got into dance more not professionally but more organized. And yeah, so we won, my fraternity won a big giant dance contest and we want a giant award for it. In fact, to this day in my fraternity, we've got like a four foot trophy sitting in our formal because of the choreography I did. And that's just one example, there were several others. But I came up as a kid, as the hip-hop guy. Shane Barker: So that's, so what's funny about, so there are some parallels. Now I was a dancer too, and I was probably not to your level, but it did. I was the guy that would come in kind of like the white guy is like, "you've got to be kidding me, there's no way this guy knows how to dance." I usually get down, I used to get down. So I use to do a lot of Hip Hop and stuff. Chad Pollitt: Nice. Shane Barker: I don't think I won any awards or anything, but I definitely came in as the red bearded guy that they're like, "there's no way this guy has anything." Chad Ha ha ha Shane Barker: You know, I'd break off a few things here and there and people like, "okay, here we go, he's not only quick, you know kind of quick mouth on him, but he also can dance a little bit. So we'll leave that on this week." Chad Pollitt: Nice, nice. Shane Barker: Yeah, and then I, you know, and then I, like I said, then I was able to gain some weight and be able to come in the pounds instead of grams, you know. Chad Pollitt: Ha, ha, ha. Shane Barker: So I was so skinny, that went down. Chad Pollitt: You and I have so much in common it's not funny. Shane Barker: It is. It is kind of crazy. Like I would have no idea but this is the whole point of the podcast, right? As we find out random facts about people, you're like, " You've got to be kidding me." Okay, so now other than being, you know, a hip-hop dancer, other than teaching Britney Spears how to dance when she got older and all that fun stuff, where did you go to college? Obviously in Indiana, right? Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So I'm an Indiana University Kelley School of Business graduate. I was the second class to graduate with an Entrepreneurship Degree. It was new. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: I actually got lucky enough to be able to teach there for three years, which is crazy. I mean if the guys I went to college with, when they found out that I was teaching, it freak them completely out. They're like, “No Pollitt's not teaching." But yeah, I did for three years. I taught Internet Marketing to seniors that were getting ready to graduate. It was a 400 level class and the only reason I stopped teaching that class was because of my travel schedule and my work. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: Which by the way, just so your listeners know, I've been sick since Thursday. So I'm just getting over it now. So if I sound a little black it's because I am a little blah. Shane Barker: Yeah. No. No, I get it. I get it. So, you know, it's funny. So here we go to more parallels. We might, we need to figure out our parents’ names because we might be related. I'm just trying to figure out like, I mean, there's, we should probably you know. The reason why I'm saying that is I actually was teaching at UCLA. And it was kind of the same deal like, when I originally got the call about the opportunity, I thought it was my friends messing with me. And then when I told my friends later that I was teaching at UCLA, like nobody believed me. I had to like take pictures of the classroom and show them like a paycheck stub like because everybody's like, "you are not teaching the Youth of America.' Oh my god, is there a glitch in the Matrix because I don't know how they got a hold of me. I don't know who Okayed this or you know who, but somehow it happened. So, it's funny, is it? So this is what we talked about, because this is teaching in the University, just tell me how different that is just than anything else in the world. I mean, I, for me at UCLA, it was like a, because my course was a three-hour course. So I would fly down to LA, I'm in Sacramento. I'll fly down to LA, it's a three-hour 6:30 to 9:30 course and it's just mainly, you talked about, you know, putting the curriculum together. You don't realized I have a newfound respect for instructors or ... Chad Pollitt: Oh, yeah. Shane Barker: Right, because you don't realize, I mean we produce content but like this is three hours right? I mean and then you got a just trying to put that together and keep the attention span of people for three hours when there's you know internet and there's all the other fun stuff out there. I mean it's it was an interesting learning lesson. I mean, I'm still over at UCLA. I've taken a few quarters off, kind of the same reason you did. It's because the work schedule and trying to coordinate everything just becomes a challenge but tell us a little bit about that. Like I'm teaching at the University, I mean, how was that? I mean, I know you did it for three years. I've only been doing it for about a year and a half now, but tell us about that experience. Well how was your overall experience with that? Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So actually I still teach for Rutgers. So I went for three years teaching at two universities. Shane Barker: So you're next level crazy. You're not even, you're not even, and you just ran past me. Like I thought we might have been on the same plateau of crazy, but you just now you're going to be the king and I'm going to be like a pawn or something like that. Okay, so you are too crazy, huh? Chad Pollitt: So I still teach at Rutgers. It's online, so it's easy. All the lectures are pre-recorded. They just play them people go through the course. I do once a semester, I do office hours virtually. So it's not the same. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: At IU, I did a two hour and forty minutes lecture. It was straight up regular College. I mean I'd show up once a week for the semester and then next semester, so on and so forth. But anyways, so what I tried to do was bring as many guest lectures in as possible. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: Because two hours and forty minutes is… Shane Barker: Grilling? Chad Pollitt: Yeah it is, it is. And in those instances where I couldn't do that I had a lot of group projects set up in advance where I would give them like, "Hey, this next hour is yours go work together as a group." Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: And that's how I would divide that up and I did that for three years, so six semesters. Shane Barker: Yeah. That’s crazy. Yeah, we did the same thing. I had actually a, I think Mark, is Mark Schaefer at Rutgers? Chad Pollitt: No. Yes, yes he is. So Schaefer actually, he's the one that brought me into Rutgers. Shane Barker: Ah, got you. Chad Pollitt: So he put together a program with me and Ian Cleary out of Ireland and a... Shane Barker: Social razor, razor social? Chad Pollitt: Yeah, RazorSocial. And we put together this program and yeah, it rocked and it doesn't require a lot of time because we prerecorded everything. Shane Barker: That's awesome. Yeah. I had, Mark was actually, he was one of my speakers at UCLA. I mean I had him because he came out with the book, oh my god, it's the most recent one. Chad Pollitt: "Known", yeah. Shane Barker: And so yeah, and so what he did is, I had him speak as that's what we would do. I mean I try to fill the time as much as I feel like I'm entertaining and strikingly good-looking, three hours of listening to me just like Jesus, there's got to be a better things in life. I do this do that been there. Chad Pollitt: Do this, been there. Shane Barker: Been there. It's too funny, too funny. Yeah guest speakers were definitely a goal. We did some group work as well. So that's kind of cool. So, how did you like, I mean, how did you jump into digital marketing? So you graduated with an Entrepreneur Degree, when did you graduate? What year? Chad Pollitt: 99. Shane Barker: 99. See, so it's funny. So I graduated, I graduated 93 from high school. But when I went to college, I went to a few different colleges. I finally ended up over at Sac State where I graduated here local college and they, it's so funny like the entrepreneur, that's funny, graduate entrepreneurship because at my college at that time, there was only one course to take and so there wasn't really like that actual degree of you know, being an entrepreneur. So tell me a little bit about that, about taking that and like how did that transition into, obviously you're going into Entrepreneurship. You're going to start your own business. But how did that transition into the digital world? Like how did you make that transition? Chad Pollitt: Yeah, so I don't consider myself an Entrepreneur. I consider myself an Intrapreneur. So I've never done anything on my own. I've always worked with partners to build stuff. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: So for me believe it or not, I started off studying Accounting which I look back at it and I'm like, whoa, I studied Accounting. That's crazy. Shane Barker: Yeah. I came to spell Accounting. I can't do it. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So I went through that program and I realized as a Junior I'm like, this is not for me, I got to do something else. And I started doing research and one of my best friends was, he went into the new Entrepreneurship, it's brand-new. I'm like, "you know what that sounds good, I should do that." So I did and finish it and I graduated and I'm like, "you know what, I'm more of an intrapreneur than an entrepreneur," and that's how I have approached my career as an intrapreneur. So I've worked for many startups, successful not successful, so on and so forth. And yeah, that's really what I jumped into intrapreneurship not entrepreneurship. Shane Barker: Gotcha. And then how did that transition to like the digital world? I mean so you've always, you obviously have your own business. You have a number of businesses, right? We'll talk about that here in a little bit. Like the digital space, like how did you physically get into the digital? I mean was obviously was kind of at that point the internet was coming around, there was some cool stuff that was happening. I mean, it sounds like you were kind of at the forefront of that kind of coming about. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So in 99, I graduated and I took a sales job. I was told by one of my mentors in College that sales is where you need to start. He told me that the majority of CEOs at some point were in sales. So I thought, "Hey CEOs that are successful start in sales. Maybe I should start sales." So I looked into sales and found myself with Pitney Bowes in 2000. Shane Barker: Pharmaceuticals? Chad Pollitt: No, Pitney Bowes does printers and mail machines. Shane Barker: Ahhh. Okay. Got you, got you. That's right. But I do remember seeing those. Chad Pollitt: Yeah, I don't know how they do today but back then they were huge. So I went to work for a Pitney Bowes and I had a regional territory that I would travel to and I meet with lots of small business owners and this is 2000. Now the web had been around but small business didn't embrace the web until about that point. And I had people hit me up as I was going through my normal work like, "Hey, you're the young kid, you know about this web stuff? Tell me about it." And I'd have conversations and anyways, what ended up happening was that they would ask me to help hook them up with folks that could make them a website. So that's what I did and I had my own network of people that a designer and a web dev and I'd connect them. So I was like the consultant. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: So from 2000, the end of 2000 to about 2004 when I went to Iraq, that's what I did all the time. I was the web guy. I'd get phone calls, small business owners I didn't even work with, "hey, can you help me with the website? So and so said you knew what you were talking about?" So I did. And then I went to Iraq, I went to OIF3 Operation Iraqi Freedom 3 in 2005 and I came back in 2006 and then I went full time in the business. So I spent literally from 2000 till late 2004. Shane Barker: So that's crazy. So let's, so this is a thing like and why did you have just out of curiosity like joining the military? Like you're out of college, it sounds like you were starting to kind of get some things going. Because you, I can tell already that you're that person is like, "hey, I want to do this" and then like if we were sitting next to each other and I was like, "hey, you know, this kind of thing I'm thinking about doing this." You're like," yeah, I'm going to go do it" and then I would look next to me and you'd be gone and you'd be doing it. Like I don't think there's no, for you, it's like once you set your eye on something, it's kind of like it doesn't, there's really nothing that should get in your way unless it wants to get hurt or something, right? I mean, I kind of feel like you're that guy that just goes. How did the military play into this thing? Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So basically, I mean it's simple, 9/11. Shane Barker: Wow: Chad Pollitt: 9/11 happened. I saw it. I'm like, "you know what, and I’m not getting any younger. If I do this, now's the time" and I did it. I pulled the trigger. Shane Barker: So it's, god did we have some weird weird connections between you and I. So I actually, after 9/11 it was two days after, I’ll never forget it when it happened. I remember in College and we were coming downstairs and I remember everything about it. Two days later I tried to sign up for the military and they wouldn't let me sign up because I had asthma. And so what I did was the recruit that I call is like, "Hey" and he's like kind of we are going through the whole questionnaire thing. And he's like why you want to join? I said, " well, you know, witness the 9/11 there's some stuff that happened and I just want to you know, I'd like to figure out what we can figure out. My family wasn't a military family by any means right. So this wasn't, like my mom found out later that I went and tried to join the military and she wasn't super pumped about that. My mom always protected me from getting into there because she was always worried about my safety, you know, just a mom protecting her son. But I tried to get in. And so the guy was like, "yeah you have asthma, we can't we can't take you." I said, "Well, how about this? I'm, let's hang up. Let's try this again, I'll call back and then we can, you can ask me the questions again." He was like, " I can't do that either." Because I was like, we can you know, just ask me the question again. I know the, I know the right answer now. Like I didn't know the right answer before. Like in July was, I was pretty adamant. Obviously they let you in and but that's funny. I was, that was a very pivotal time, pivotal moment for me in my life of like, " Wow, this is like, I want to go, probably was a little emotional that, but definitely very emotional just because of what happened there. But that's interesting that you went and serve your country. I think it's awesome. And I want to thank you for your service. That's phenomenal what you did there. Chad Pollitt: Oh, you're welcome. It made me the man I am today. Shane Barker: Yeah. That's, I kind of wish I would have known where, you know, and I think everybody has their path. And I don't know what would have changed for me if I would have taken that path. But I figured that there was somebody up there that says, "we don't want change the military" for whatever reason, right. So that's not much I could do. I try to do my part to get involved. But that's awesome you were here man, that you did your part. Chad Pollitt: Thank you. Thank you. Shane Barker: So let's, did that. I mean, I don't know if this is going to kind of lead into this. I mean, did the military, like you have multiple companies, multiple step that you do. Like, how do you keep that, how do you manage that workload? I mean I'm thinking is that, did the military help you with like, you know, systemizing things? Have you always been somebody's been really organized and you've got a lot of projects going on right? I think as we all do. We get in this, we're sick mind of like starting more and more stuff, like how do you manage that? Like, what are you like for your workload and stuff like that? Chad Pollitt: It's a lifestyle, basically. I mean technically I think I have ten jobs. I sit on three advisory boards. That's not a lot. I mean just when they hit me up, I answer them, it's virtual. So it's not a like a big time commitment. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: I'm on the Governor's Council of Cybersecurity for the State of Indiana. That actually is a lot of work. They hit me up via email, constantly. Then of course my full-time job with Impowered... Shane Barker: Yeah Chad Pollitt: ... as their VP of Marketing. I don't have a staff so I don't have to deal with that. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: But there's some negative downsides to that as well. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: I don't have the support that I would like. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: As far as my being a Columnist on lots of different websites, they don't really bug me too much. I send them content when I come up with it, but it strategic. It's for inPowered. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: And then I'm on the speaker circuit when I travel. Travel messes me up because I'm off the grid. I sometimes can get internet on the plane, sometimes they can't. And if it's a long flight, it's a long flight and then I lose nine hours or 12 hours or whatever it is. But yeah, I juggle it and I make it work. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. I know traveling is hard. I mean, it's, I know when I, especially if you go International and I go International, and my calendar is just absolute array. I mean, I don't you know, obviously not looking forward to having a call at 3 a.m. You know not knowing where they're at, what's going on? So that is always a challenge of that. We've been kind of putting processes in place right now so that I can do more of that and so that the team can kind of take that on. Shane Barker: So when, because you do so many different things. I mean, do you, you have to have a team right? I mean, do you have, are you kind of a, you a single Gunslinger? You got all kinds of outsourced people or what do you do? I mean you can't, you got a lot of stuff going on Bud. I know that's a newsflash for you. I know you didn't know that until I just told you that. But you know, like you have no idea. Chad Pollitt: It's so I'm a one-man show at my main company where I work, where I make my money. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: It's a lot of begging and pleading for support across departments. Up to the founders across two different departments. It's the nature of the beast right now. That will change soon, I'm hoping knock on wood. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: But yeah, I'm a one-man show as of now, and it sucks. I'm used to having a staff but I just need to make Proof-of-concept get some revenue in which is happening and then I'll get the people I need. Shane Barker: Gotcha. And that's on the inPowered side, right? Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Yeah. Shane Barker: Gotcha. Cool. And so let's talk about, because I know one of the real reasons we're talking today is like Content Amplification. And I know that you just came and you just do the Guide to Native Content Amplification. So you just you just Ritz, when did you write that and just recently? Chad Pollitt: Yeah, yeah. So we published that just before the New Year and it's out there it's free. It's available at chadpollitt.com. It's at the top of the website. So it's, yeah, feel free to download it. I wanted to put together a very poignant piece that went directly to how do you do this? I wanted to cut through the crap and get directly to the point. And that's what I did in this particular piece. And that's why it's so valuable and it's blowing up actually. Social media today, Native Advertising Institute and relevance.com. All three of those have promoted that eBook, because it's good stuff. If you want to amplify your content in a paid way via native advertising or social, it's a must download and it's free. Shane Barker: Yeah, you can't go wrong with that. Well, you're always pumping out great eBooks. I mean you always, always seeming like I said, I know we've downloaded quite a few eBooks and read them because, just the content you put out there. And that's what's intriguing to me is that you're, you know, one person team. And I don't know how you do it. I have 33 employees and I still feel like I don't have enough. So I don't know how you do it with just that but I do know the content you put out is been epic and that Content Amplification... Chad Pollitt: Thank you. Shane Barker: ...is big just because it's like, I mean, like its one thing to write content right, but it's another thing to get it out there, right? And I think that's what a lot of people miss, is like you can have what's in the best product in the world, but if you're not marketing with the right people, same thing with this, you can have great content, but how do you amplified that? How do you get it out there? So give us a little bit, I mean obviously I'd highly recommend everybody downloaded it. But I, give us some, can you give us some key points on amplification? Like if somebody doesn't, can't download it because they are in their car right now or something like that. Like if there was some good little nuggets of information from Chad, like what would you tell them? Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So, I'm going to give you a top level… Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: ... idea of amplification. So we live in the world of AI today, Artificial Intelligence. Now every single platform or network will tell you they do native advertising. We've got native advertising and they'll tell you we have artificial intelligence on top of that native advertising, which is cool. But you have to ask yourself the question. What does this Artificial Intelligence optimized towards? Okay. So you as a Content Marketer, what do you want to accomplish? Do you want to optimize clicks on your articles or would you prefer to optimize engagement on your articles? I mean, what do you think as a Content Marketer, do you want people to engage with your content or click on a headline? Shane Barker: I don't care about clicks, I want engagement. I want people to be engaged. Chad Pollitt: Yeah, exactly. inPowered is the only company in the world that optimizes using AI towards engagement, only one. In fact, we only charge for engagement. So if somebody clicks on a native advertising unit on Facebook and they spend 10 seconds on that content and bounce, we don't charge you. We're trying to change the whole game. It's not about interruption anymore. It's about being native and it's about actual content engagement and we're trying to change all of advertising using this methodology and our AI. Shane Barker: So it's interesting, but that's and that of course, I'm sure there's every other platform the world that hates you guys because that's what they don't want, right? They want to be able to say, "Hey if you were on the website 4.2 seconds, you should be charged." I mean Facebook is pretty extreme in the sense that you can be anywhere on the page and the people don't even have to scroll down and they considered a view or conversion. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Shane Barker: Or they pretty loose metrics when it comes to that. I know clients will be like, " I don't look I'd 27 conversions." I'm like, "how are sales though?" I'm like, "I don't know if that's really a conversion." So that's interesting. I didn't really, I mean other than what I've seen in the summer step you've done out to take a look at the cap cause that's really interesting especially from an AI standpoint. To be able to look at that only paying for engagement, which is really the key, that's what we want right, engagement on anything. Chad Pollitt: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean the alternative is paying for conversions, but that's more of a direct response-type content engagement. I mean we do that but it's not the core of what we do. I mean we know there's a middle and top of the funnel. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: And much more that content is being produced. So there needs to be a channel where we can amplify that content and then charge based on KPIs that people want, right. I mean we could work with Content Marketers all day long on conversion metrics, but that's bottom of the funnel, content. And we know most people aren't creating bottom funnel content, they're creating middle and top funnel content. So that's where our platform really really helps brands. Shane Barker: So how does that work? Like explain to me the process? So I'm a Content Marketer, so what I do, mean is it like in the back end and then you put the content up and then you're linking to it somehow and then it's easy and like, what, give me.. Explain to me the process on how that would work myself if I wanted to go take a look at it, and then how does that work? Chad Pollitt: So as a Content Marketer, there's three things we can help you with. So let's say you're doing earned media, which most Content Marketers do, let's say you have some sponsored content, so you're working with the New York Times. And let's say that the Huffington Post wrote a great article about your company. Okay, so earned media, all three of those we can amplify and get it in front of people on over 40 Networks. Social and Native and really get it out there. And then what our AI does, is through machine learning, it figures out who's the most likely audience to spend 15 seconds or more with this content? And then it optimizes towards that. So that's basically in a nutshell what our platform does. Shane Barker: Huh! That's interesting. All right. I'm going to take a look at it because I'm all, I mean, you know, like I said I've got a pretty big team that does a lot of amplication for us. We use some software and stuff, but I might have to, we're going to have to chat about that because I definitely would like to see how that goes. Chad Pollitt: Oh, for sure. Shane Barker: It's going to be awesome for sure. Chad Pollitt: And by the way it it's the same thing with like app downloads and other things in the content marketing world. Yeah. Oh, we can talk about, okay, got you. Shane Barker: And then how do you think, so we talked about like, the content amplification and like I mean, what is, how does that tie in when you think when it comes like SEO, like organic rankings and stuff? Like I guess, I want to explain to the people that maybe, I mean some people obviously I think would understand what content amplification is. But like how does that help you? Like, what is the benefits of it other than getting the word out? Is it like SEO benefits, like what would you see is that like being the big benefits of the implication that you guys did? Chad Pollitt: So the main benefit is actually getting it in front of relevant people. Shane Barker: Yeah. The right people. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So the right people at the right time on the right platform. So that's the main benefit. From an SEO perspective, now I go back last decade. I've been in SEO for like 12 years. So I've seen the evolution. I know it, I know Google's recommendations, so on and so forth. I can tell you that our platform at this point does help you in SEO and here's why. If you write an article and you use paid media to send 20,000 people to that article, Google notices that and Google thinks, "huh, maybe this article is important?" and Google will reward that article. I mean, that's just the nature of the beast, right. Now if you dig into the details of what Google says, basically they tell you paid media does not help you at all. But we know that traffic to a page helps in organic search and in this situation it absolutely helps. Shane Barker: That just makes sense. In fact, that more, get more eyeballs on. I mean, Google wants to see traction with articles, right? So that just helps the situation if you can amplify especially to the right crowd. I think that's the key to the whole thing is a... Chad Pollitt: Three AI and machine learning. It's like going to the right people, right? Shane Barker: That's the hardest part. Chad Pollitt: Yeah, I can send this out to 10,000 people but is it the right, right? Would I have 10,000 of whatever might be potentially the right people are will have 500,000 of the right people, right? The idea of this since like is really really drilling down and making sure that perfect client is potentially, a perfect potential client is potentially senior content. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: I think it's a big. Shane Barker: So I would say we talk about any kind of a secret recipe? It sounds like your secret recipe is not so secret. It's inPowered. That's who you guys, that's who you're working with and that's who you're putting your content through. So it sounds like once again not so not so much a secret anymore, I guess. Chad Pollitt: Yeah, so let me throw this out. So and again, I apologize to your audience, I've been sick since Thursday. What I've learned from doing research is first of all, the average television executive, for every one dollar they spend on creative, they spend five dollars on distribution and amplification. The average Content Marketer does the opposite, they spent $5.00 on creation in one dollar on distribution. Now this is changing and some brands are doing a good job of not doing that. But basically most of the industry is where I just described and that's going to change. It's changing and it has to change. We have a legacy of people in our industry from last decade that are used to the publish and pray. So last decade we could literally hit publish and Google and the social media networks would take care of everything. And it would drive all the traffic and KPIs we needed. It's not like that today for most industries. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: Unless you're a snail farmer, you pretty much, you need to think about the five to one ratio, $5.00 on distribution, $1 on creatives. You can't swap those today in most industries. Shane Barker: And then, so tell me about the snail farmer. Why do they not have two numbers scale? No, I mean, that makes sense to me. So that's kind of, yeah, that is it's kind of an interesting way to look at things right? Because it is the amplification. I've a company that we work with, it's, they're called Lumanu and they do the amplification of like, of like influencer marketing campaigns, which is kind of interesting because it's like, "hey, it's one thing to influence a market in five six years ago." I was like, "hey, you just put up a picture of you with your creatine bottle" and then all of a sudden all gun sales would come through. Well now it's a different deal right? Like how do you amplify that content? I mean, how do you take that content and continue to add dollars to it and then keep it going right? So I think that's what you want to figure out. I think it's more effective in the sense that you don't necessarily have to pump out more content, you just have to be able to promote the right content? Chad Pollitt: Exactly. Shane Barker: Which is the key. Chad Pollitt: Exactly. Shane Barker: Which I think it's finding, you know, which content is you're getting some traction on them and really putting some money behind that because and having a goal I think that's another thing that people from a content perspective. A lot of people don't like know what their what their goal is, right? What are you trying to do with that content? When you are producing content, there needs to be a goal in mind and I think people, in the beginning I know I didn't produce content in any goal. My goal was just to get some content. I was Tuesday for god sakes right, I'm supposed to be out Tuesday at 8 a.m. So now it's like now it's obviously keywords and all the other fun stuff. Now we're looking at a situation where you know where you can be a lot more strategic about why you put content out and how you distribute it. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Absolutely. Shane Barker: Yeah. So what would be, I mean, what are three software's you can't live without? Doesn't have to necessarily do it with distribution of content. But like what are three software's that you're like if I didn't have this, life would be just terrible. Anything too exciting, fun, you can share. Chad Pollitt: So for over 10 years, I've been a Tweetdeck user. Shane Barker: Tweetdeck, yes. Chad Pollitt: Loved Tweetdeck. I've never messed with HootSuite or any of the others. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. That's a big one. SEMrush is awesome. Shane Barker: I love SEMrush. Chad Pollitt: It's not perfect, but you know what it gives me the data I need to make decisions. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: Love it. I mean I hate to say this but Google Analytics gives me what I need to do my job, and I'm in it every day and I appreciate it. So I think those are the three that I would say. Shane Barker: So singing Tweetdeck. I still had Tweetdeck and I still use Tweetdeck. I haven't heard Tweetdeck in a long time. In fact when you said Tweetdeck, I think that's what I use. It's been so long since I've actually like, you know, I didn't think, couldn't think of the name. So Tweetdeck is absolutely I use. SEMrush, I use that once when my teams in there all day long. That's like a given when it comes to, you know keywords and cluster keywords and all the other fun stuff that goes into SEO or any kind of content creation. We do for our clients as well, so we're blog articles. We write and put the keywords in there and monitor them. So it's there's a lot of different stuff. I love SEMrush because we just so many different, they're always coming out with new stuff and trying to you know, they just recently they did like the, what is it? Like if you go and you get you know, brand mentions and stuff like that, I think that's their kind of critique. No, no, that won't work. I'm helping critique that a little bit because there's some issues there. But anyways, well, I guess in a nutshell SEMrush is always evolving and they've got some good stuff going there. So kind of fun to be able to see that. Kind of cool you use that as well. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. You know what? I'll throw out there, I'll juggle Google Analytics with BuzzSumo. Shane Barker: Yeah, yeah. Chad Pollitt: Love BuzzSumo. Love me some BuzzSumo. So here's the thing. I use BuzzSumo to tell me (a) what headlines rock. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: Right and (b) what content resonates with people to the point where they share it and link to it. I use BuzzSumo every day as well. So BuzzSumo and Google Analytics you can juggle them but I love both of them. Shane Barker: Yes. I know Stephen and Susan over there, i know they do a phenomenal job and they're just, they're one of those we get that same as well. We get brand mentions that will come, they get pulled in. They, it's kind of funny, I get more brand mentions. They're are able to find more brand mentions in my Google Alerts from work, which is kind of funny because you'd think the Google Alerts would have, you know would know everything. It's all knowing, you'd think. But BuzzSumo is definitely the one that has a fuller report for me and we do the same thing, you know to look at content that did well and who shared a new link to it? So it's, that's when you really get a tool that works like what you're saying and how we use it as well. It's just phenomenal. Once you really understand how to use it. It's like, it's kind of crazy with the amount of, like the information that's out there right for us. I may not wish marketers to be able to go and take a look at your competitors and things that are going on and how you can optimize that make things better is always kind of fun too. Once you get a good system in place is kind of fun, to kind of take that on. Chad Pollitt: Yeah, yeah. It's funny because you mentioned Google Alerts. It stopped working for me for some reason. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: And then I just moved straight to BuzzSumo and then never went back. Shane Barker: Yeah. The only reason I bring up Google Alerts is because like some of my presentations, if somebody's looking for a free option, but I'm like the crazy part is Google Alerts will send me maybe to a month and usually it's because there's a guy, Shane Barker that was killed. Like I'm not kidding you, like in like New Zealand. I'm like, we're looking for looking for his killer. We've got this and I'm like, oh he going like what? Like, what do you mean killer? Like this isn't even had to do with me. So this poor guy in New Zealand that got my got murdered. I know more about this guy in New Zealand than anybody because I get his alerts every day. But yeah, it's kind of, it doesn't, yeah. It doesn't really work that well. I used to mention .com as well, just to kind of back that up a little bit. But yeah, it's interesting for sure to be able to do that. So nice to be able to get that kind of information because it's, there’s so much information out there when you know, it's nice to be able to have that be sent in and through an email and then you receive it. So how cool? So how many eBooks have you written? You've written a lot of them. I know there was one like the Global Guide to Native Advertising Technology. Like what are some, I mean how many eBooks have you written or do you even know? You probably have to go count right now and you... Chad Pollitt: It's over 10 now. It's either between 10 and 12. If you go to chadpollitt.com, you'll see my most recent ones. Now, there are other ones I've written that I've retired because you know, our industry changes. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: I pulled them. But yeah, go to chadpollitt.com. There's I think around 10 maybe 11 there. Shane Barker: And then so what each one is? What is your process for when you get some constant together like that? I mean, I know everybody has their own processes and you've obviously got a good process down to your writing, you know, you're running to ten, eleven, twelve books that you've written otherwise eBooks. Like what is your process for doing that like? How do you get the content together? Like, how do you go about it? I mean obviously lots of research. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So I actually spend one to three hours a day reading. I mean, my bosses probably wouldn't like. But to do what I do you have to do that. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: As far as my process goes, it's like making sausage. It's not a process that you would, that any company would come in and say, "Hey, this is a great process." Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: It's my mind working on the front, the back, the side. It's just me making it happen. What I tend to do is create content over time on other websites and bringing that content together. And then setting up those transitions between those articles to make it read like a book. And that's generally my process but I'm all over the place man. I mean, I'm at the top. I'm at the bottom, I'm on the side. I'm in the middle, it's everything. Shane Barker: Yeah, that sounds like me. So as you and I like how you slip, know you kind of slipped in the sausage thing. So tell me about your eating habits, Bud? I've looked at your Instagram, you're little bit of a foodie like myself and maybe some alcohol involve. Like let's chat a little bit about that. I'm like, I just had to put myself on restriction for like two weeks and try to lose a few pounds because I'm staring at your Instagram. I'm not going to follow you because you're not going to help me lose weight. But tell me a little bit, you look like you're quite the cook and you always like to come up with some really cool stuff. Explain to me how did this come about when you're jumping on them? I'm looking in them right now. And I'm probably drooling on my computer little bit which is not recommended but what do you got going? Like is this all you? Like, you all good, you get into the kitchen, you make magic happen or what? Chad Pollitt: Yeah. So I've got a smoker, Weber smoker, a Weber gas grill and a Weber charcoal grill. So I've got all three and yeah, I will throw a hunka something like some pork on the smoker for 12 hours. I'll cook a smaller piece of say beef on the charcoal grill for four hours or I'll cook some chicken on the gas grill. It's just something I like to do. It relaxes me, and its good food. So that that's my story. I take pictures of it and put it on Instagram. Shane Barker: There we go. There we go. I got to be honest man. I wish you lived closer. I mean, I'm just saying that now that we could become best friends and stuff since we became the only white dancers in America. I mean, I just felt like there was a connection there. That's awesome. Yeah. I can tell by your food man, that looks good. I'm a, I don't even post half the food. There was a certain point where I quit posting tons of food and quit posting what I was drinking because I thought people are just going to think I have a problem or maybe I realized I did have a problem or solution. I don't I'm still trying to figure it out. But I was like, no, no man, this thing I used to put. So there was a good buddy of mine that owns, like a beer thing. You can put in all your beers and there's a certain point where I was like, I don't think I have a problem but I'm like, I don't know if this is my ratio of like, of having fun and drinking beer side like a little beer Club. I own a thing called NorCal bruise, which was a website that we would do beer, you know, like whatever like reviews and stuff like that. So it was fun. But anyways, maybe too much fun. But it was definitely good time definitely going on for sure. Chad Pollitt: Nice, nice, nice. Shane Barker: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So what about you? You like a beer, whisky guy, you like Scotch? What are you? What's your equal opportunity? Or so. Chad Pollitt: So, I've got a bar at my house. I just actually installed it was actually pretty cheap. I bought it off Amazon. I got a refrigerator. I have guests over occasionally and we use the bar. I'm more of a vodka drinker, occasionally drink beer. Not much of a wine drinker.If I do I drink white wine. But I got it all available for guests when they come over. So it's all in the bar. Shane Barker: Yeah. There we go up. I'll go ahead and book a flight right after this. This is awesome. Oh, come on down have a vodka drinking contest or something. So we're going to be finishing up this podcast in a little bit. So tell us something. What do you dislike about being a marketer? Obviously it's a lot of fun stuff. Actually tell us what you like and what you dislike. Like, what was it, if there was something you said, "Hey listen, there's some I want to change about being a marketer or something about the industry, what would that be? Chad Pollitt: Oh, that's easy. Shane Barker: Aright, that's it. Huh? Chad Pollitt: I hate this thing. Shane Barker: That iPhone. Chad Pollitt: Most weekends if I can swing it. I don't touch it. Shane Barker: Just turn it off. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Plug it off, get rid of it. Being constantly connected is annoying. I mean it didn't used to be. It used to be gratifying as I came up. But you know being in this business since 2000 - 2001, when you're off, you want to be off. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: You can't with this. Shane Barker: Yeah. Chad Pollitt: You can't, it sucks. Shane Barker: Yeah. I'm with you on that. It's funny, so I, my schedule back in the day, I used to really have it pretty somewhat control. Back, back, back in the day, I was terrible 20 hours a day. Chad Pollitt: It was a nightmare for everybody involved Shane Barker: Me too, me too Chad Pollitt: Like there was all, you know is all gas no brake right. But yep, just recently I just move my schedule back to where I don't do anything before 9 a.m. It's my morning times. I'm working out. I'm doing this and walk whatever I want to do. Like more me time and now I am done at 5. And now it's been, we've been doing this a long time, right? So this isn't like I'm not recommending that if you just started your marketing business that you should start, you know, holding your hours and only work for six hours or something. Like the idea is that we have people that will help but and then for me, is I realized that like, what am I don't want to be a slave to work, right? Like there's, we've worked really hard to get to this point and now there's a smarter way of doing things. And it's not necessarily working more hours. And so, you know, when you look at efficiencies and stuff like that, I appreciate that and I haven't fully like this. Let me give you example, this week and I didn't work at all. No, it's not, I just lied to you. I did, I work Saturday morning for two hours. But it was just that I want to get in and knock the stuff out. I didn't work yesterday at all, which is you know, for if my wife's listening and she's like, "yeah, that's like the one time this year that he didn't work." We can write as should probably call me a little bit. But I am trying to switch that up a little bit because I think it is important to have that time. Well, you're not just go go go, right? And I think the phones and the technology, once again, at the first was a blessings like, "oh, now I can jump on this and respond right away and do things and then later on you like me and I'm kind of a slave to the phone, you know. Kind of like I'm everything that pings and does this and does that. I mean the phone was designed for that in mind, right? To keep you on it. I mean, they the psychology of it and then being in the noises and all this and you messages coming in things or buzzing when there's a there's a reason for that right? They want you to pick up that phone and be engaged and I Apple just came out. It's funny. Now they have their like, this is your what is it screen time, which is kind of sobering, you know, I get this thing and it's like... Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Shane Barker: "Oh, hey your screen time and five hours a day." And I'm like, "Jesus now," and I can say "hey, I'm a marketer and I do stuff online and I want to see stuff but man, it's kind of a sobering experience when you lay... Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Shane Barker: When you learn out how to spend that much time. Like what could I do with that five hours, like bones anything like MIT cooking or whatever? Anything other than you know, I mean, that's one of the things recently where I was like, I'm going to start working out again. Long story short, I hurt my back CrossFit and leg went numb. It's a long story, but I'm found myself, like sitting on the couch looking at Instagram for 20 minutes, you know before I meeting or something like what am I doing? Like get out and do something, like move around or something. So anyways, I've changed some of those things recently, but it is kind of an interesting deal on how you know, once again being connected was so great because now my god I can do everything for my phone and the other crappy part is like damn it, they've got me. You know, like I can't. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Shane Barker: I can't get away, you know, and so I think it's that's always, that's kind of a harsh reality. It sucks to have to do that, you know like to be that connected but like to be able to disconnect I think is a gift, you know, if you're able to do it. Chad Pollitt: So check this out, So for Christmas, So for Christmas, I went to the Dominican for two weeks. I try to do that twice a year. I know people down there. But anyways, I went down there and my phone got stolen within like three days. And I was literally disconnected... Shane Barker: Literally. Chad Pollitt: And it was awesome. I've never been so thankful that somebody stole my phone. I mean, yeah, I'm pissed. I mean its $1,000 phone. I could have, well I planned on giving it to my kids. So that was disappointing. But yeah, the fact that I didn't have it for that vacation. It was amazing and I can't, I don't even know how to describe it. I mean it was amazing. I was literally disconnected for two weeks. Shane Barker: Yeah, it's funny. So I like I said, probably more last few years, I've really tried to put things in place to where I mean, I remember reading something a long time ago. They're like, you know, if you if you don't really have a business, if you're not there and the business isn't still running, right? Like where it's a situation where like you feel like if you have to be in the middle of it, then you know, you have really built a company, you are responsible, right? Chad Pollitt: Right, right. Shane Barker: So and I think that's always been something for me. It's like; if something was to happen to me will my company continue... And that's always been you know, because I don't want to have to always be in the middle of everything right? I don't have to because I'm passionate about what I do, but they're just and we're just like just recently really kind of started to kind of like try to pull me out of the business more and do more of the speaking stuff in the Consulting and all that stuff which I've been doing anyways. But I'm anyway, so it's been an interesting transition for me because it's you know, it's my baby. So I always want to be in the middle of everything and I've learned this over 20 years man, you know, it's like you want to be in the middle everything and you get to a point where you like you don't necessarily need to you know, it's the world's not going to end it if this doesn't happen or if I don't respond to this email on Saturday; like Monday people will still be alive. Like I'm not like a brain surgeon, you know, it's not like, it's not that what I do isn't that important? So I don't know, I just think that's a good that's interesting for you. Have you ever thought about maybe hiring somebody to steal your phone and then give it back to you like maybe for like 50 bucks or so. Like if he'd be like, "hey, sorry about that Chad like I wanted to give you your phone back. But you're, you know, you're whatever your girls hired me to do this and so here you go, and they're going to get your thousand dollar phone back. Chad Pollitt: No, but I will tell you that my next vacation. I'm going to turn my phone off, plug it in and leave it in the room. Shane Barker: It's awesome. Chad Pollitt: For sure, but I'll tell you so that was one side. The other side that's very positive about our industry is the camaraderie and the people you meet. Whether it's Chad Pollitt meeting Shane Barker or whether it's us hanging out with Mark Schaefer or Ian Cleary or anyone else in the industry. I mean, I've met so many great people around the world too, throughout Europe, South America, Moscow, Russia. I've met some really awesome people and I've relationships with people that I cherish and I appreciate. And that's the biggest positive I think of our industry. Shane Barker: Yeah, I'm with you on that. I do think it's I like, it's because I'm a very open person like with anything. But I do like anybody asked me, some people remember, you know a long, long time ago, I feel like people would like, I don't want to tell anything now everybody's puts everything online sauce. Chad Pollitt: Yeah. Shane Barker: Like in the fact that when you meet those good people that are willing to share because it's like there's plenty of business and all this for everybody. Like to me, there's like no reason to not like make it a collaborative effort. Like I don't look at anybody as a competitor and not in an ego type way, but just of a way of like there's stuff I can learn from you. There's stuff you can learn from me. There's more power and us working together to try to achieve that than to be competitors or whatever you know, however you want to put that. But this has been awesome man. I'm really, like I said, I keep saying this, this is the reason why I started this podcast is so now I can go meet people and you know, maybe you and I will start a dance crew one day or something like that. Because obviously once we go back and go back and start it back up or I don't know what will be the like the ADCS, as it'll be two of us now or something. I don't know. We'll figure it out. We'll figure out what the name is going to be. But Chad, it was an absolute pleasure interviewing you today, but I really appreciate you being on the podcast and we got to stay in touch. Chad Pollitt: Oh, absolutely and hey, it was my pleasure. And again, I apologize to your audience. I've been sick man for, since Thursday and I'm still rolling with it. Shane Barker: I know you're doing, you're doing good Buddy, and you’re going to be just over the hump here real soon. Chad Pollitt: All right. Awesome. Shane Barker: All right, brother, man. You take care. Thank you for everything. Chad Pollitt: All right, bye.